Those who have attended the recent concerts of ULTRAVOX, JOHN FOXX, HEAVEN 17 and Thomas Dolby may have noticed a striking satorially astute personality in the audience with the make-up and piercing eyes.
Looking like he’s just failed an audition to join SIGUE SIGUE SPUTNIK for dressing too smartly, that new kind of man is Tapio Normall, concert goer extroadinaire from Finland.
His trips seeing many of the artists from the classic synth and new wave era have been documented on his website The Amazing Adventures Of Mr Normall. His charming photographs with acts as KRAFTWERK, SPARKS, JAPAN, ULTRAVOX, GARY NUMAN, MARC ALMOND, THE HUMAN LEAGUE and VISAGE have become tales of electronic music folklore.
Just prior to visiting London again to see GARY NUMAN, JOHN FOXX, MOTOR and MIRRORS at Back To The Phuture, ELECTRICITYCLUB.CO.UK caught up with Mr Normall to reminisce about his travels and meetings with various lumanaries key to the rise of electronic pop music in Europe.
How did you come discover the joys of electronic and new wave music?
I remember that moment very well: I was 15 years old, it was summer and I was sitting in my parents’ car. The radio played ‘Computer World’ and few other tracks by KRAFTWERK. I knew right then that this is my kind of music. I had already tried punk and even a bit of rockabilly, but they weren’t my thing. The first vinyl album I ever bought was ‘Die Mensch Maschine’ by KRAFTWERK.
Who are your favourite acts?
JOHN FOXX, ULTRAVOX, VISAGE, KRAFTWERK, JAPAN, THOMAS DOLBY, HEAVEN 17, DURAN DURAN, SOFT CELL / MARC ALMOND, ASSOCIATES / BILLY McKENZIE, ADAM ANT, SIGUE SIGUE SPUTNIK, DEAD OR ALIVE and many others.
What was your first concert?
A Finnish band called RATSIA. They started as a punk band but then moved towards new wave. When I saw RATSIA, they already had synth on stage and the guy who played it looked like a ‘rock’ version on Nick Rhodes.
The first non-Finnish band I saw live was CLASSIX NOUVEAUX. This was November 1982.
What inspired you to first journey abroad to see your favourite bands? It is because Finland is often missed out on touring schedules?
There were MARC ALMOND, SIGUE SIGUE SPUTNIK and DURAN DURAN gigs in London only a few days apart in December 2000. All my big favourites and no chance to see them in Finland. I’m glad that I went to see them because it was the only time I saw the Martin Degville, Tony James and Neal X version of SIGUE SIGUE SPUTNIK.
There just aren’t many gigs in Finland that I would like to attend. It takes me only few hours more to travel to London than to Helsinki, and you can always find fairly inexpensive hotel in London. There’s no such thing as inexpensive hotel in Helsinki.
When did it occur to you that your travels were now becoming more than a habit?
I think that started summer 2006 when I went to London to see THOMAS DOLBY live at the Scala. The last few years have been like the second (or third or fourth) coming for many of my favourite artists/bands. This time has also been a sort of ‘second coming’ for Mr Normall. My passion for these things was almost lost during ’90s but it all started to come back after 2000 and it’s getting better and better. 2010 was great: THOMAS DOLBY, ULTRAVOX, JOHN FOXX, HEAVEN 17, MARC ALMOND.
You meet a lot of the people from the bands themselves and the ‘handshake’ photo with them has been a regular endearing feature of The Adventures Of Mr Normall. How do most of them react to meeting you, especially with your striking persona?
Heh heh… I believe all of them has seen more peculiar things than me! Actually everyone has been quite nice. Some artists have recognized me, which to me is a funny thing to notice. The internet makes things possible.
Often, you manage to get an invite to the aftershow party. How easy or difficult have you found to arrange this?
I have learnt one thing: it goes easy or it doesn’t go at all. Some aftershow passes I have asked, some have been offered to me and I’m very grateful for that.
Who have been your favourites stars to meet and why?
This question may lead to “Oscar speech syndrome” (just made that up) and I don’t know when to finish. I just leave it to that *laughs*
Tell me a funny story about one of your many meetings…
I don’t know if is this funny but I tell it anyway. 15 years ago – March 1996 – Italian songstress Alice had gig in Turku (Finland) and ex-JAPAN members Mick Karn and Steve Jansen were in her band. My sister Tuula lived in Turku then, so Marjaana and I drove there to visit Tuula and to see Mick Karn and Steve Jansen live.
My idea was to go to the gig venue in the afternoon just in case we could see Karn and Jansen there. We went inside the venue, walked around and found Mick Karn, Steve Jansen and Robby Aceto in a small room and they obviously were just killing time waiting for the gig in the evening. They were apparently delighted that they got company and they were so very friendly. Mick Karn asked to show him from a map where we had come and he was astonished at how far north we had drove to Turku.
Before we left the venue – to return there later in the evening – they asked us tips what to do and where to go in Turku. We told them the best known sights there; Turku Castle and few others. It occurred to us later that maybe they actually wanted to go to the Turku city with us (I told them earlier I was there by car). They would have had both a local guide and ride back to venue with us, but we just weren’t able to read between lines. So we left Mick Karn, Steve Jansen and Robby Aceto where we found them and went to the city without them. If I had asked, maybe I would have had half of JAPAN on the backseat of my car.
We met Karn and Jansen again in the evening. There is a picture of Tuula, Steve Jansen, Marjaana, Mick Karn and I on my website. The picture is taken by Alice. She was actually the star of the evening but we forgot to take any pictures with her. I didn’t meet Mick Karn again after this.
At The Blitz Club Reunion, I approached someone who I thought was Mark Shaw from THEN JERICO and it turned out it wasn’t? Have you ever had this embarrassment on your adventures?
Yes, but other way around. I’ve been mistaken for Billy Idol, Neal X – those were long time ago – and more recently for JohnFoxx. The latter was last summer on the day of John Foxx’s Roundhouse gig.
I was staying in Camden and at one point during the afternoon I left my hotel to go to a shop. I was wearing black ‘Glimmer – Best of John Foxx’ T-shirt, black trousers and virtually no make-up. Walking down the pavement I heard “Hey John!” but I didn’t realize it was meant for me.
Then a couple of blokes politely stopped me and asked if I could “sign these”. They had several John Foxx 12″ vinyls with them. As far as I can remember I said “yes I can but I think it’s better if JOHN FOXX does it, not me”. That was a good start for the John Foxx themed evening.
Was there anyone you met who perhaps wasn’t as friendly as you’d hoped?
No, not really. Ralf Hutter didn’t allow to have photos taken but he signed me several KRAFTWERK CD covers and chatted a bit. He is a gentleman.
So what do you think of the proverb that you should ‘never meet your heroes’? Can it ever go too far?
I suppose it depends what are your expectations and what you want. I haven’t had big disappointments but instead, the uplifting feeling after meeting an artist I have listened on the records and seen on the music videos since my teen years. That’s the story so far.
You have a friendly, engaging personality but do you ever worry you may be considered by some to be a stalker?
I hope not. To be honest, I don’t have enough interest in anyone particular for that. However, when I travel from Finland to London specially to see live an artist I haven’t met before, it’s not a big sacrifice to wait an hour outside the gig venue to possibly get a few photos taken for my website.
What are the options? Go back to the hotel, shopping, sight seeing, pub… actually a pub doesn’t sound too bad *laughs*
Is there anyone you would still like to meet and be photographed with?
Several people: Adam Ant, David Sylvian, DURAN DURAN, Siouxsie, Pete Burns and – dare I say it – David Bowie. Those names came first to my mind but there’s several others as well.
Is there anyone from history or who is no longer with us who you would have like to have met and why?
Billy MacKenzie – in my book he was the best singer ever. Also meeting Andy Warhol would have been a big thing for me.
Favourite live concert of all time?
It’s too difficult to decide which one is my favourite concert ever. However, if I can expand this to a whole day including pre and after parties and the live concert, then I have the answer: it’s ULTRAVOX at Hammersmith Apollo in April 11th 2010. That was a great day.
Yes, I was there too, what a great gig! So who would you say is your favourite band of all time?
JAPAN.
Your favourite album?
‘Gentlemen Take Polaroids’ by JAPAN. It is perfect.
ELECTRICITYCLUB.CO.UK gives its warmest thanks to Tapio Normall
‘Is That The Twelve Inch Mix?’ is a new book about the history of remix culture by author Rob Grillo whose previous publications have included the best seller ‘Anoraknophobia’.
Featuring a foreword by Martyn Ware, Rob affectionately traces the development of record collecting and describes it as “A light-hearted look at the 1980s, the rise and rise of the remix and the twelve inch single… and The Human League”.
ELECTRICITYCLUB.CO.UK is pleased to be able to publish three extracts from this excellent book…
From the past until completion…
Of course, the record that is synonymous with the twelve inch single is ‘Blue Monday’ by New Order. Initially released only in twelve inch format in 1983, there was no regular seven inch pressing available to the public.
This was nothing new: twelve months earlier Motown’s Gary Byrd & The GB Experience had hit the top ten in the UK with ‘The Crown’, in twelve inch and cassingle only. And ABBA, of all acts, achieved a similar feat in 1981 with ‘Lay All Your Love On Me’: that didn’t even have a cassingle to help it reach number seven.
However, ‘Blue Monday’ captured the record buying public’s imagination, and it became the biggest selling twelve inch single ever, eventually selling over a million copies in the UK alone. The single initially reached number twelve, before climbing again to number nine later in the year.
The first pressings, in a floppy disc sleeve designed by Peter Saville, proved far more expensive to manufacture than at first envisaged, although claims that each copy sold lost the record company money are a little wide of the mark. Later pressings did see a slightly simpler sleeve used, but one which still did not display too obviously either the title of the song or the name of the band.
Unless you also owned a copy of the band’s subsequent album ‘Power Corruption and Lies’, the coloured blocks on the ‘Blue Monday’ sleeve meant nothing: as only the album sleeve contained the key to deciphering this series of blocks, you were none the wiser. Many people who bought the album were still none the wiser. This hardly affected sales, though: most record buyers knew exactly what they were looking for when they went into their local store to purchase the single, and most record store assistants would have known exactly what do should they have been met with any enquiries.
To confuse matters, some pressings of the single came with the centre labels placed on the wrong sides, thus confusing some purchasers about which track was ‘Blue Monday’ and which was the B-side, a dub version of the track called ‘The Beach’. The song itself is rumoured to have been recorded initially to test out some new technology (a drum machine in layman’s terms), but also to satisfy audiences who criticised the band for not performing encores at their concerts. New Order could perform an extra part of their set with minimal effort – walk on stage, press a button, and, hey presto, ‘Blue Monday’!
Of the tracks that are reputed to have influenced the track itself, Sylvester’s disco classic ‘You Make Me Feel (Mighty Real)’ is probably the best known. Ironically, as Factory Records were not members of the British Phonographic Industry (BPI) – in other words they were an indie label – ‘Blue Monday’ never attained its initial gold status (awarded for 400,000 units for singles in the UK).
The track eventually appeared as a regular seven inch single in 1988, when it was reissued in a remixed format. There was a further UK reissue, featuring various new mixes, in 1995, and the track has been sampled and covered by a number of acts in recent years.
More notoriously, and mentioned elsewhere, Bobby Orlando and Divine ripped off the track for their HI-NRG monster ‘Love Reaction’. New Order didn’t bother taking legal action – the success of’ ‘Love Reaction’ no doubt contributed to further sales for ‘Blue Monday’ itself.
In more recent times a mash up with Kylie Minogue’s ‘Can’t Get You Out Of My Head’ has been given official licence as ‘Can’t Get You Out Of My Head’. The Factory story, and the almost anarchic way in which business was done, has been told many times, but at least New Order themselves were able to make a little money from the new twelve inch format. This was not always the case. George Michael and Andrew Ridgeley were originally handed a golden spoon by Mark Dean’s CBS subsidiary Innervision in 1981. Their hastily signed deal allowed them little in the way of proceeds from regular single and album sales, and even less from twelve inch sales – where they earned not a penny from each copy sold to the public.
It took a while for recording deals to recognise and catch up with the phenomenon. As the late ’80s brought important changes to the release of singles in general – the twelve inch single at the forefront of these – it was inevitable that in order to keep pace, the way in which singles charts were compiled would also have to change. The twelve inch single was of course not the only format alongside the traditional seven inch vinyl pressing. As mentioned previously, record companies dabbled with different variations of the cassette single – or cassingle as it was often known. There were early trends towards releasing a ‘cassingle’ with two tracks, basically the A- and B-sides, an identical alternative to the seven inch.
Later a cassette of twelve inch tracks was preferred, selling for roughly the same price as twelve inch vinyl. There were coloured vinyl twelve inch discs and picture disc twelve inch singles too. Neither of these was an original idea, having been around for over a decade in their seven inch guises. There was also the occasional far more obscure ten inch record. OMD with ‘Souvenir’ and the Pet Shop Boys with ‘West End Girls’ offered mixes on their ten inch pressings that were at the time unavailable elsewhere, but generally the ten inch was a rare commodity, and certainly a pain in the arse to play if your old-style turntable had automatic settings for seven or twelve inch vinyl only!
For those with an eye to detail we salute you…
Take 12ZTAS1 for example. Or rather, one of the most controversial yet brilliant singles of the ’80s – Frankie Goes To Hollywood’s ‘Relax’.
Now many readers will own, or will have owned in the past, a twelve inch copy of this track – the Sex Mix is indicated on the sleeve and label. Except that the chances are this was not actually the Sex mix at all. It was most probably the US mix. Unless you’re a real collector or a huge fan of Frankie Goes To Hollywood, you’ll never have known the difference. Ignore the label: it probably isn’t the Sex mix. Well, this is the story.
Producer Trevor Horn recorded several variations of this track (including an unreleased Warp mix, which was a seven inch white vinyl promo-only release). When it was initially released we were given the seven inch mix (actually the Move or Suck It mix) and a sixteen minute Sex mix on twelve inch, with initial pressings at 33rpm and later ones at 45rpm – all with the catalogue number 12ZTAS1. This Sex mix actually contained none of the song itself, but was a rather peculiar track that featured Holly Johnson rambling on to himself together with several rather odd noises created in the studio by Trevor Horn, all overlaid by a tribal beat and culminating in what was supposed to be a fulfilling climax (in the literal sense!). It didn’t go down too well in the clubs.
One of the criticisms was that it was far too long and never actually managed to get out of second gear, so it was difficult to dance to. An alternative mix was produced, therefore – an eight-minute edit of the Sex mix called the New York mix. It had the same catalogue number, and the only way you can tell the difference between this and the 45rpm Sex mix is by looking at the matrix number etched onto the inner vinyl (12ISZTAS1 to be precise). There was no indication anywhere that this wasn’t the Sex mix.
Unfortunately this new mix did little to stem criticism of the track. Horn got it right third time around, though, when he recreated the popular seven inch version, added a long instrumental build-up and created the US mix which we all know so well. Nobody thought that the original sleeve or label should be changed, however, so all the US mixes were pressed as the Sex mix. It then got that bit more muddled when new commercial pressings of the Sex mix were labelled as the Original mix.
Confused? Well, in recent years things have got that little bit more complicated. At least one Frankie Goes To Hollywood CD release refers to the US mix as the New York mix – further confusing themselves as well as a whole host of Frankie Goes To Hollywood fans worldwide. There is also a separate disco mix that until recently had only ever been released in Greece!
When the brilliant and long-awaited follow-up to ‘Relax’ was issued, the band and Trevor Horn didn’t disappoint . . . or confuse themselves/us/everybody else. In truly creative style they merely put out a number of different twelve inch versions of the new song, ‘Two Tribes’, luckily with different catalogue numbers and contrasting picture sleeves, so kick-starting the trend for multiple twelve inch issues in order to further record sales.
First up was the Annihilation mix, a nine minute epic that featured the voices of Patrick Allen and Ronald Reagan (actually Reagan was voiced by Chris Barry, who was behind the same character on ITV’s Spitting Image). Next up was the Carnage mix, which featured the unforgettable and rather disturbing line, “mine is the last voice you will ever hear”. These chilling messages were recorded by Allen for the British government as part of their ‘Protect and Survive’ programme of the late ’70s and early ’80s, which aimed to give the general population information on what to do should nuclear war ever break out.
Trevor Horn then decided to remix the B-side, ‘War’ (a cover of Edwin Starr’s 1970 hit), so a third twelve inch pressing contained ‘War’ (Hidden Mix) backed with ‘Two Tribes’ (Carnage mix). ‘War’ was re-categorised as the AA-side rather than the B-side. Finally a limited supposedly DJ-only Hibakusha Mix was pressed, this being the same version used on the extended video soundtrack which received many airings on national TV. There was a shorter video that featured the seven inch version, and there were alternative videos for ‘Relax’ too – all this well before any of the tracks were later remixed and re-released for later generations. Lost yet? I won’t bother explaining how some of the seven inch versions of Frankie Goes To Hollywood singles differed slightly.
Re-make/Re-model…
The record companies soon cottoned onto the fact that remixes could even be recycled. ‘Why not put them on an album?’ they said. The Human League and Soft Cell were leaders in this field.
Flush with the immense worldwide success of their third album, ‘Dare’, the former put out ‘Love and Dancing’ in 1982 under the pseudonym League Unlimited Orchestra. This was a mini-album containing dub versions from ‘Dare’ (as well as ‘Hard Times’, the flip side to the single ‘Love Action’), all loving recreated by producer Martin Rushent.
The public went for it, the album reached number three in the UK album chart and went platinum. Earlier the same year Soft Cell followed up their debut album ‘Non Stop Erotic Cabaret’ with the remix album ‘Non Stop Ecstatic Dancing’. This is considered to be the first ever remix album.
Other artists followed suit, with variable degrees of success. The Pet Shop Boys took the idea even further, and have continued to release a series of remix albums – their ‘Disco’ series and Introspective adorning the shelves of hundreds of thousands of fans across the globe. And then came the idea of a compilation album that contained only twelve inch mixes (for example, Now Dance being one of the ‘Now That’s What I Call Music’ series). There may have only been three or four mixes each side, but labels such as Morgan Khan’s Streetsounds created a niche market for themselves. With the advent of the CD this has proved much easier to exploit, as there aren’t the running time and sound limitations that vinyl had.
So the best remix of all time? Well, that’s an entirely subjective question. I will, however, touch on two tracks that I regard as prime examples of (a) how bloody great it can feel to get your hands on a really great twelve inch single, and (b) how, occasionally, a remix can breathe new life into an already great tune and send it into dance-floor hyperspace. The first isn’t a remix at all: it’s a full length mix. In their early years New Order didn’t bother to put their singles on albums; they were released separately – but when they finally started doing so one of their finest moments was edited right down for the release of their third album, 1985’s ‘Low-Life’.
There was no commercially released seven inch format for ‘The Perfect Kiss’, but in its twelve inch glory it was unsurpassed by anything else that was released that year. In just short of nine minutes the listener journeys through Bernard Sumner’s insistent lyrics before there’s a beautifully crafted four and a half minute instrumental outro that takes the listener higher and higher and yet higher, before climaxing in a dramatically disorganised crescendo. Sheer beauty. The full length mix has never appeared on CD: the closest you’ll get is the mix on their unmissable compilation ‘Substance’, which is some eighteen seconds short of the original. Eighteen seconds! That’s nothing, I hear you exclaim. It is if you’re a music geek.
The second example brought new life to a track that even in its regular seven inch format remains one of the most endearing tunes from the ’80s. And yet it took three official releases before Talk Talk’s ‘It’s My Life’ hit the higher reaches of the singles chart in the UK. The fact that the extended version issued on twelve inch in the UK was pretty limp and lifeless didn’t help the song’s cause. Things were very different in the States, however. The now legendary DJ Steve Thompson was commissioned to create a mix that was more appropriate for an American audience, and what he came up with proved to be undoubtedly his finest moment in a large repertoire of remixes.
Rebuilding the track with a much more upfront beat, and yet never straying far from the original, he created another tune that simply builds and builds before another long outro that takes the dancer – or listener – to heaven and back. It’s sheer brilliance. But remember, it’s the US remix. Don’t be tempted to go for the extended version that appears on far too many compilations; you won’t go places listening to that.
And finally . . . Heaven 17. Messrs Marsh, Ware and Gregory had already had a worldwide smash in ’83 with their first top ten UK hit, ‘Temptation’, on which Carol Kenyon added a fantastic female accompaniment to Glenn Gregory’s vocal. There was no need for their label, Virgin Records, to commission a remix, as the original was so strong that no new mix could ever do it justice. That is, until remixers Steve Anderson and Dave Seaman, better known collectively as Brothers in Rhythm, came along and blew everyone away with their new seven minute reworking, which first surfaced in Ibiza clubland. The band themselves initially knew nothing about the new mix, but they and their record company had no hesitation in having the single reissued in its new form.
The result? Nine years after the original, ‘Temptation’ smashed its way back into the UK top five singles and was again a worldwide smash, the new mix teasing the listener – and the dancer – for a full three minutes with its infectious beats until the track cascades into life with Gregory’s famous vocal opening. It’s a perfect example of a radical reworking that manages to stay true to the original. Simply bliss. And make sure you purchase tickets for Heaven 17’s next gig: a highlight of this fantastic experience will be their rendition of ‘Temptation’ that takes in the best of both versions, accompanied by a phenomenal vocal performance from current guest vocalist Billie Godfrey.
ELECTRICITYCLUB.CO.UK gives its sincerest thanks to Rob Grillo
History Will Repeat Itself and the HEAVEN 17 renaissance continues…
Following a well received collaboration with LA ROUX for BBC 6Music and not one, but two TV specials featuring the triumphant concert at Sheffield Magna and ‘The Story Of Penthouse’ and Pavement, Glenn Gregory and Martyn Ware are about to embark on a full UK tour celebrating their landmark debut album after a successful European excursion earlier this year.
Martyn Ware of course was a founder member of THE HUMAN LEAGUE before leaving with Ian Craig Marsh to form the production company BRITISH ELECTRIC FOUNDATION (BEF). With its pop subsidiary HEAVEN 17 featuring Glenn Gregory, the success of ‘Penthouse & Pavement’ and ‘The Luxury Gap’ with its international hits ‘Temptation’ and ‘Come Live With Me’ led to it becoming the priority project over at BEF Head Office.
Simultaneously though, Ware was able to maintain a successful production career which over the years has taken in artists such as Tina Turner, Terence Trent D’Arby and Marc Almond as well as ASSOCIATES and ERASURE. He later founded Illustrious with Vince Clarke to exploit the creative and commercial possibilities of 3D sound technology.
Through Illustrious, he also conceived Future Of Sound, a not-for-profit organisation to provide a forum for the discussion of new and convergent art forms. Among those involved are HEAVEN 17’s guitarist/programmer Asa Bennett and artist Malcolm Garrett, best known for his album artwork for DURAN DURAN and SIMPLE MINDS.
As part of the 30th Anniversary celebrations, the homecoming show at the Magna featuring the ‘Penthouse and Pavement’ album and the extended cut of ‘The Story Of Penthouse and Pavement’ are released as a double DVD package.
Featuring additional BEF cover gems ‘Perfect Day’ and ‘Wichita Lineman’ alongside ‘Ball of Confusion’ sang by Billie Godfrey and ‘These Boots Are Made for Walking’ featuring PROPAGANDA’s Claudia Brücken, Strong Films have successfully captured the evening’s vibrant performance including the futuristic LED screen projections where a variety of visual artists were given free reign to interpret HEAVEN 17 and BEF’s music of distinct quality. These digital videos have been included as bonuses along with rehearsal footage to give a unique multimedia insight into this special live presentation.
Also being released is a deluxe 3 disc collector’s edition of ‘Penthouse & Pavement’ featuring a CD demos from 1980 with versions of songs from the ‘Pavement’ side predating the Linn Drum Computer. These showcase a unique hybrid funk driven by crashing early HUMAN LEAGUE style rhythm sounds. In addition, there are alternate mixes of ‘Music To Kill Your Parents By’, ‘Uptown Apocalypse’ and ‘A Baby Called Billy’ from the BEF ‘Music For Stowaways’ sessions.
In the midst of a busy promotional schedule for the ‘Penthouse & Pavement’ tour and its related artefacts, Martyn Ware took time out to talk about his career and the resurgent interest in HEAVEN 17.
How was it playing Back To The Phuture night at Bestival in September? I understand you played ‘And That’s No Lie’?
It was an amazing event actually. We did an hour with Elly from LA ROUX on Radio Bestival or whatever, so that was before we even went on stage, that was quite fun. It was in a big top, we headlined that night. It’s kind of a warm-up because the main days are Friday, Saturday and Sunday but there was like 8500 people there. The big top was completely full but more to the point, it was about 90% people under 30 and they all got it. It was not a shock as such but very heartening to see that people were digging it and presumably, most of them weren’t familiar with a lot of the songs!
Elly from LA ROUX joined you on stage for ‘Sign Your Name’. Are there any plans to work together in the studio?
We’re constantly talking about doing stuff. It’s not so much us. Elly, she’s writing a new album and I think she’s trying not to be too distracted. But we are intent on working together. Obviously at some point, we’ve still got an intention of possibly re-releasing ‘Temptation’ with her singing the lead part.
I spoke to your backing singer Billie Godfrey earlier this year and she suggested that ‘Are You Ready?’ from ‘Before After’ might be good as a LA SEVENTEEN collaboration?
She would do cos she co-wrote it! We love Billie. *laughs*
I do like that song; we’ve only performed it live once I think at The Scala in 2005, so we may revisit that. We’ve got seven albums worth of stuff to pick from so you can’t fit everything in, it’s impossible!
You have a UK tour this November playing the whole of ‘Penthouse & Pavement’. Have you arranged anything different for the forthcoming shows?
Me and Glenn were discussing the tracklisting for the new tour and he put a provisional one together. I looked at it and it was two hours long! Even hardened HEAVEN 17 fans would find it a bit wearing! We do have a lot of stuff and we will do a couple of interesting new things on the tour.
Anything you can give away?
Not yet, we haven’t really narrowed it down but we are planning to do at least one track HEAVEN 17 track that we’ve not done before and then another BEF track.
How did you find touring Europe in your own right earlier in the year?
Tremendous, it was a lot of fun. It was great touring on a sleeper bus, everyone loved it. Not particularly comfortable, but Glenn liked it because he could hold court and it was like being in his own pub travelling around! Of course, I’ve given up drinking now which is not a good thing when you’re touring.
It’s good fun for us, not a chore and I’m sure we’d think differently if it was like 50 odd dates. A short tour, we look forward to very much. Also, the people we work with are all so professional, a lot of them work with other bands and say they enjoy working with us a lot. It’s a nice vibe. It’s driven by a love of music and everybody gets on. Isn’t that the ideal kind of job to have?
I was at the Cologne show and it was a mad evening that went on for ages due to a few technical hiccups but you really rose to the occasion with Glenn doing a few acoustic renditions. What are your personal memories of that night?
Is that the one where the drum kit fell apart?
Yes, and someone threw some underwear at you!
Oh, I loved that! The underwear was great! The one I particularly remember was Hamburg at Fabric. It was astonishing, just doing loads of encores until we ran out. The reception that we received generally in Germany was just outstanding, we weren’t really expecting it. We thought we’d be well received but as a curious pleasure rather than in some cases, ecstatic! So if we get that kind of response on the British shows, we’ll be very happy.
Photo by Tracey Welch
Which song did you find the most challenging to recreate for the live environment?
‘I’m Your Money’, it’s difficult because it’s such a particular sounding record that. We weren’t writing songs with the anticipation of playing them live so ‘I’m Your Money’ is very… say for instance we waved a magic wand and it was exactly the backing track that we did… we can’t do because we don’t have the original tapes.
But if it was exactly the same backing track as we did in the 1981, I think it would really jar on the ear! It’s incredibly repetitive and monotonous but on record, it sounds great. So you kind of have to back off on the frequencies that really hurt and really make it work in a different way. What’s made it work for us is the brilliance of Julian Crampton on the synth bass; he’s given it all sorts of funky inflections. It’s leaning toward that FUNKADELIC thing which is great. It wasn’t difficult in terms of programming; it was more in terms of vibe.
I’ve noticed Glenn has a habit of missing his cues live. What’s the thing you always hope you don’t do during a gig?
Losing my voice towards the end is a big issue because I do a lot of singing, probably more than people realise. The focus is on Glenn obviously and Billie but when are only touring with one girl, which is what we’re doing with the ‘Penthouse & Pavement’ line-up, what we normally use the second girl for plus all the unison and harmonies stuff with Glenn is me and it’s tough on the voice. What’s particularly tough is the whole monitoring set-up is for Glenn which is fine for him because he’s got in-ear monitoring and he’s the lead singer so he can have what he wants basically… I normally have to put up with what’s left! *laughs*
So you can easily strain your voice if you’re not careful. It doesn’t matter on one-off gigs particularly but on a tour you’ve really got to be careful.
Have you had any voice training or anything?
No, but I know how to breathe and how to achieve what I want economically and when to do chest and when to do falsetto, what my break point is; and I’ve learnt through just literally being streetwise about it, what works and what doesn’t. Like Glenn, my voice has got more powerful over the years… if we were to sing acappella, I’d out-sing Glenn in terms of volume! Also, I’ve got a tendency in winter to get chest infections if I’m not careful so it’s always an issue for me… it’s happened on two tours so far and it’s a horrible thing when you have to sing through that! *laughs*
HEAVEN 17’s profile had been enhanced by the LA ROUX collaboration and the two ‘Penthouse & Pavement’ programmes on the BBC including the documentary…
That was amazing! It’s an endorsement of the idea that you should just do stuff rather than think about it too much because a good friend of ours, Joe Strong of Strong Films had wanted to do proper HEAVEN 17 documentary about that period of our development for a while. He’d heard all the stories when we were out getting p*ssed and thought it would make a good story. So we did it for our own reasons and we were just going to release it on DVD. It was just one of those fortunate coincidences. Joe has a lot of contacts in the BBC and at the time, he mentioned to somebody that he just finished editing and this person said “that’s good because we’re just doing an 80s season on BBC2, would you like to launch it?”.
Originally, the idea was to have two solid hours of HEAVEN 17 on BBC and we were going “this is insane!”, you couldn’t buy that kind of exposure! The only other band that’s got that kind of exposure this year as a legacy act is THE ROLLING STONES! Of course, it cost quite a lot of money to push it though and get it all edited and we’re still trying to make the money back but the point is, if you show faith in quality material and it’s shot well and the story’s interesting, it creates a virtuous circle of people having confidence that you’re doing things for the right reason. That means a lot in the BBC in particular because they’re not so commercially driven, they just want good quality stuff.
And it’s led to all sorts for us. It’s led to a massively increased amount of live work because we’ve just signed to William Morris Agency who are huge. And at the very outset from when we signed to them, we said “there’s no point in getting signed to a bigger agency if we’re going to get lost in their vast slate of artists but we want establish ourselves as credible artists from that period and we want top perform as credible artists, not just some trixy 80’s pop band! That’s where we want to go, can you help us?” And they said “That’s fine, then if you do it properly, we can get you into all sorts of festivals”.
We’ve hardly scraped the surface in terms of festivals across the world, we’ve done a couple in Europe but the rest have been in the UK. We’ve never yet played properly live in America which is amazing frankly seeing as we had a No1 record in the Billboard Dance Charts in the 80s with ‘Let Me Go’.
So we have a vision for the future for the first time in a long, long time. We have a structured plan and we got David Stanbury who’s our new manager… we’re really putting some effort and money into it. For the first six months of this year, we were running at a loss. But now it’s paying back. It’s a big thing to do when you don’t have the support of a record company, much harder.
There’s lots of things you can do that don’t require big time logistic support like ELECTRICITYCLUB.CO.UK and lots of other blogs around the world. We’ve put a lot of effort into it, we believe in what we’re doing and we believed what we were doing in the past was really good and we believe that we’re good at performing it. So do fortunately, the audience.
How did you convince Phil Oakey to discuss the break-up of the original HUMAN LEAGUE on the documentary?
What it was, we were going up to Sheffield to perform at a charity gig for a friend of ours Dave Kilner from Radio Hallam who unfortunately died. We’d done some filming when Glenn and James said “can’t you just ring up Phil?” cos we’re mates now. But he’s notoriously difficult to contact, let alone get him to approve anything!
So they kept bugging me and bugging me. I said I’d give Phil a call and see what happens! I said “we’re in Sheffield City Hall… it will take about quarter of an hour, would you come down?”. And he said yes! I couldn’t believe it! So I took my little flip HD camera, set it up on my home tripod… it came out looking like CCTV footage in an interrogation room which I quite like because we didn’t have any proper lighting or anything! But we didn’t have anything planned. He didn’t say “don’t ask me about this”, I just asked him as a mate what he thought and he was very candid.
You’re working a lot with Mark Jones and his Back To the Phuture brand. Of course, his Wall Of Sound label have signed THE HUMAN LEAGUE… you know what I’m going to ask? Any chance of you and Phil Oakey writing or recording together again?
I don’t know, I personally would love to do it. I don’t have any issues left. Some of the best creative work I’ve ever been involved with was writing with Phil, he’s a brilliant lyric and leadline writer. What can I say? The first two HUMAN LEAGUE albums ‘Reproduction’ and ‘Travelogue’ have some genuinely fantastic moments on them. Still ’til this day, I think things like ‘The Black Hit Of Space’ and ‘Marianne’ are unsurpassable in that genre to be honest. I’d love to work with Phil, it might be a bit strange after all these years but I personally would love it.
I understand Phil might be doing a solo album in parallel with THE HUMAN LEAGUE so I don’t know if…
… there’s an opportunity possibly! Yeah, he seems a lot more open to collaboration now. He’s always done a bit before, he did ‘Together In Electric Dreams’ and that stuff with ALL SEEING EYE at one point but it’s good for him to spread his wings a bit because he’s got an iconic voice and songwriting style. It’s not for me to say but there is a possibility he could work in different environments other than THE HUMAN LEAGUE. Sometimes it’s just good to free yourself to do something with no expectations.
So have you got anything going on outside of HEAVEN 17 at the moment?
I’m doing the new BEF album ‘Dark’. I’m a bit nervous about saying which tracks I’m doing in case anyone nicks the idea but I suppose I could tell you one of them… last week I just finished ‘Didn’t I Blow Your Mind This Time’ by THE DELFONICS. It sounds amazing even though I say so myself, I’m so pleased with it. It’s done in a kind of darker fashion.
Are you able to say who’s singing it?
I don’t know, I haven’t got any singers yet, I’ve just done the backing tracks. I’m still open to suggestions if you’ve got any ideas! But it has to be either established artists or contemporary artists who are quite high profile, that’s the only thing! I’ve got plenty of people suggesting complete unknowns to me and I just haven’t got room for that because I’ve got to sell some albums. Talent we’re not short of but I need to get some famous people on board.
The concept works and I’m really pleased with it. Glenn’s obviously going to do it and Martin Fry from ABC’s agreed to do one. I’ve not asked Elly from LA ROUX but I’d be surprised if she said no… and so on and so forth. There are various people, contemporary singers that I like. I really like the singer from EVERYTHING EVERYTHING, I like his voice a lot. I think he might be suitable for something quite dark. I’m thinking about getting some actors in as well. I quite like the Rod McKuen kind of direction or William Shatner, depending on how you look at it *laughs*
‘Penthouse & Pavement’ is being reissued in a 3 disc package with a CD of demos. How different do these sound compared with the recorded versions? As different as the two versions of ‘Temptation’?
Some of them are… some of them are very similar and we just polished them up. But the biggest revelations are the demos that we found that were lost for 30 years literally of ‘Play To Win’, ‘Penthouse & Pavement’ and ‘Soul Warfare’ which are awe inspiringly different and funky. They sound like rare groove versions of HEAVEN 17. Both myself and Glenn had completely forgotten they existed. Just for those three tracks alone, I was so vibing on that… I think that’s worth the purchase price alone. But there’s a whole bunch of half baked/half finished experiments, there’s about half an hours worth of different experimental tracks that never turned into anything which we found as well which was really exciting. That CD is pretty damn good actually, I must say! And it was all made ’round about this time thirty years ago.
With those three ‘Pavement’ demos you just mentioned, can I just ask what you were using rhythmically on those because I’m assuming you didn’t have the Linn Drum Computer at that point?
No, it was just immediately prior to us getting the Linn Drum so those original demos we’d have been using the Roland System 100.
If the whole album had sounded like the ‘Penthouse’ side, then it would have been based on these demos if you know what I mean.
But the guitar and bass playing, this was when we first met John Wilson and there was no pressure on him, he was pouring out… very relaxed playing and super funky! He was a very young guy bear in mind, so we go into a professional studio… he still great on the album but now you can hear the difference. He was very relaxed in Sheffield, kind of loose in that great way but down in Townhouse when we recorded him, he was more pin sharp but not quite as loose.
Can I ask whatever happened to John Wilson?
Yes, you can. He recorded with us for three albums and then he just kind of disappeared. He worked with various people as a session player for a while but he was always incredibly shy, he wasn’t made for the rough ‘n’ tumble of the music business. And I think what happened if I remember rightly is somebody didn’t pay him for a bunch of sessions he did. These are the sort of things you have to roll with the punches or else you’ll never have a music career, disappointment happens on a weekly basis! But he just couldn’t handle it, he was very religious and I think he just thought “I don’t want any of this” and went back to his bedroom… I think! For all I know, he might be out there playing, we’d love to contact him and offer him some work.
Photo by Gered Mankowitz
You were harnessing a lot of new digital technology like the Linn Drum Computer at the time which was one of the distinguishing features of HEAVEN 17 at the time. How did that open up your horizons as to what you could achieve musically for the album?
The Linn Drum became within a day, the new direction… that and discovering John Wilson were the two things that defined ‘Penthouse & Pavement’.
I just got on well with programming it. It appealed to my mentality because you had to approach it from breaking the song down into bars and then at the end of a section you fill, it appealed to the logical part of my brain very much. It got to the point where I could programme really complex stuff in an hour for a 4-5 minute song. That would be the definitive thing, it’s not like “it kind of sounds alright, what shall we do?” because the sounds were very solid and good. They responded to an experienced engineer or producer toughening them up or compressing them.
It was our idea of heaven after subjecting ourselves to desistitudes of live players. Suddenly, we controlled something that sounded kind of real so it was the ideal bridge for us from the purely electronic world to the apparently real world. But it was rhythmic surrealism because there was loads of stuff I could do with the Linn Drum that was physically impossible for a drummer… and that I got criticised by various drummers saying “you couldn’t even play that!” But well, that’s good because then we’re doing something no-one else has ever done before!
So how does Joel McFarland, your live drummer find doing all this stuff?
He regards it as an amazing challenge. He’s got a first class degree in percussion from The Royal Academy of Music, he’s one of these dudes who could do the Evelyn Glennie thing with multiple mallets and stuff. He can play Stockhausen, all that sh*t!
His favourite thing is Linn Drum programming so we’ve got the actual original sounds and we just put them into his Yamaha brain, the central processing unit for his drum kit and we just wind him up and let him go!
What did you use for percussion on the more electronic ‘Penthouse’ side, was it an analogue drum machine?
I think it was all System 100 although we did have a Roland TR606 but the sounds were so terrible! And the only other drum machine we had was a Doctor Rhythm.
The subject matter in ‘Penthouse & Pavement’ is still relevant in the current climate. Musical trends are cyclical but so it seems are politics and economics. What are your thoughts on that?
Incredibly sad! But I’ve got a funny story for you… somebody on Facebook today said “Can’t believe it! Miners are celebrating, Liverpudlians are celebrating! Is Margaret Thatcher dead?” It just made me laugh, it’s very good isn’t it?
I think what is doubly ironic is one of the lines on the first song of ‘Penthouse & Pavement’ is “History will repeat itself”… and it has! And oh my god, we’ve got some suffering to come! I mean morally and conceptually, I fear for the working classes in Britain. I think there will be civil insurrection. And I’ve lost count of the number of people who say we should reissue ‘(We Don’t Need This) Fascist Groove Thang’!
Are there any plans to take ‘The Luxury Gap’ out live in the future?
Yes! Glenn in his traditional role as sceptic is um-ing and ah-ing while in my traditional role as ‘bull in a china shop’ is going “of course we’re going to do it”! So it’s somewhere between the two. It’s looking quite likely that we’ll be doing another European series of dates in late Autumn next year. And we almost certainly will do ‘The Luxury Gap’ there as a trial before we bring it over to Britain.
It’s a different kind of album to do live because I think it’s going to require an extra keyboard player because of all the brass and the strings. We don’t really like putting too much on the backing track, you can end up sounding a bit karaoke if you’re not careful. But then it’s a cost issue, it’s all difficult.
For instance, the European tour we did… even though it did very well at the box office, it just about broke even because of the production we were carting around with us. It’s a bit more economical in Britain because we’ll be selling more tickets anyway. It’s fine here but in Europe, you have to show faith and spend a bit of money to break the market.
‘The Luxury Gap’ sold a lot more than ‘Penthouse & Pavement’, it was more directed at the general public rather than the cognoscenti. That’s the definition of popular music, if you can do it intelligently then you’ve got the best of both worlds. I’m very proud of ‘The Luxury Gap’, it a very good album. Musically it’s very intelligent, there are certain elements that are superlative frankly like having THE PHENIX HORNS ESQUIRE, ‘Temptation’ etc. Some of the lesser known tracks work really well, you’ve got Simon Phillips on drums…
… ‘Lady Ice And Mr Hex’ is one of my favourites
Yeah, I mean it’s a brilliant piece, certain elements of it are serendipitously brilliant but then I’m a big fan of ‘How Men Are’ looking back on it. I think it’s an under rated album and that was when we were probably in our most daring and creative phase. I regard ‘Penthouse & Pavement’ is the most groundbreaking of the albums, but that’s primarily because of what was going on around it at the time.
Looking back on the ‘Pleasure One’ and ‘Teddy Bear, Duke & Psycho’ period after that, what do you think now?
I think after ‘How Men Are’, several things happened. There was an overall moving away from daring music that was going on in the British music scene towards a more structured marketed thing. We weren’t new anymore so the only path we had to go down was carrying on writing good pop songs.
And during ‘How Men Are’ when we were trying to get on Top Of The Pops to do ‘Sunset Now’, Glenn exploded his cartilage in his knee on the day we were meant to film that and he had to go to hospital. And nobody but nobody f***ed off the BBC in those days! If you ever f***ed up their schedules, you never got on Top Of The Pops again and that’s exactly what happened! Which is really wrong but that’s just the way it was! That kind of killed the promotional activity on that album which is a real pity… not abroad but just in Britain.
So consequently when it came to making ‘Pleasure One’, we’d lost our confidence a bit because it felt like we were slipping. So we started employing more session players and moving towards a more traditional rock sound. And that wasn’t a deliberate decision. We lost confidence not in our songwriting but in the sound that we had, so it like really lost a bit of identity…
… yes, it happened to THE HUMAN LEAGUE, OMD, ULTRAVOX; it happened to the whole lot of you!
We wanted to move on but there wasn’t anywhere to move on to from a sound point of view. We couldn’t go back to being all electronic, it seemed like we had to keep trying new stuff but in the end, it sounded a bit more old fashioned. Having said that, I think ‘Contenders’ is one of my favourite tracks we ever did, I really like that. But generally, the album wasn’t fantastic I have to say!
And ‘Teddy Bear, Duke & Psycho’ was the nail in the coffin; we’d completely lost our way by then as far as I was concerned! We were retreading some ideas and some of the things we were doing were not working. I think we all knew it had run its course at that point. But ironically, it wasn’t that we’d run out of musical ideas, it was just that vehicle because at that time, I was doing Terence Trent D’Arby’s album which showed myself, Glenn and Ian that we’d still got creative ideas but we’d lost focus on what HEAVEN 17 should be at that point.
The break did you good as you came back with ‘Bigger Than America’ in 1996.
I really like that album, it was our attempt to get back to the electronic sound. I said we’ve only got one chance to do this retro thing and show people because everyone was in the middle of that dance thing at that time. We thought we’d show them what these original sounds are like in a song context and things like ‘Dive’, ‘Bigger Than America’ and ‘We Blame Love’, they’re really good.
But you had a setback almost straight away. Any thoughts about how that album disappeared off the radar?
It was bad timing, we signed to an imprint that was owned by the guys who did SNAP! They then basically lost interest in their label about a month after our record came out and it reverted back to Warners in Britain who’d got no interest whatsoever in the album so they just killed it!, They were just terrible, they’d got no idea and didn’t particularly like it. It was just marking time really. Which was a pity because there was some good things on that album, it could have been more successful. I think we might re-release it on our website.
You’ve re-released your last album ‘Before After’ through the website as a limited edition of 100, each in unique artwork. How did this idea come about ?
What happened was we originally couldn’t find anybody to put it out so we pressed some up ourselves to sell it and then it got picked up by another label. But we’d forgotten there were 100 that we’d pressed up that were just sitting around in a box. So these albums are still in the wrapper, we might as well sell these. And then we came up with the idea from seeing an exhibition of an artist who had done 50 different covers for a 12 inch single. And I thought wouldn’t it be great to do 100 different album covers and do it as an art piece, signed with a letter of authenticity.
It’ll help pay for the next album that we make or whatever. And so we did it and it came out really well. They’re all excellent, the great thing is people have started going when they get their copy “oh, I’ve got Number 43 and this is what it looks like… “ and because they’re all completely different, they post them up on line. It’s really nice. We’ll sell them at the gigs as well and it’ll sell out once we start touring.
What’s next for yourself? Will you do another ambient project with Vince Clarke?
We’re not going to do anymore new stuff on Mute but there is ten years of Illustrious output which I’ve never released. So I might do a big boxed set in some interesting format which I’ve yet to determine.
I love ‘Spectrum Pursuit Vehicle’…
… it’s good isn’t it? We’ve got seven or eight hours of this stuff, some of it’s really good. I’m sitting on it really because I know somebody will want to buy it eventually.
‘Spectrum Pursuit Vehicle’ is not facile stuff, some thought went into it and it’s beautiful… it’s not whale song or terrible spa music! And that album was rendered in binaural so it does mess with your head when you listen to it on headphones.
Anything else?
I’m just negotiating doing a Future Of Sound event in Sydney Opera House next June which is going to be called Future Of The Centres. I’m probably going to compose a new piece for that together with various other artists. I’ve been talking to The British Film Institute about doing a soundtrack to a quite important Russian science fiction film from the 1920s which I can’t reveal what it is. That would almost certainly be on at the BFI in the middle of next year. I’m looking at various other compositional stuff with the BFI where they’re re-examining what was new over the years. I’m hoping to be the music curator for that. There’s quite a lot of stuff coming up.
ELECTRICITYCLUB.CO.UK gives its warmest thanks to Martyn Ware
Additional thanks go to Peter Noble at Noble PR and Kayleigh Watson at Name PR
The deluxe 3 disc collector’s edition of ‘Penthouse & Pavement’ is released by Virgin Records on 22nd November 2010
The ‘Penthouse and Pavement Live in Concert’ with ‘The Story Of Penthouse And Pavement’ double DVD is released by Blink TV on 15th November 2010 and will be available at the merchandise stand during the tour.
HEAVEN 17’s 30th Anniversary Penthouse and Pavement Tour
Dates include: Edinburgh HMV Picture House (22nd November), Glasgow O2 ABC (23rd November), Manchester Ritz (25th November), Birmingham HMV Institute (26th November), London HMV Forum (28th November), Oxford O2 Academy (29th November), Brighton Corn Exchange (30th November), Bristol O2 Academy (1st December)
Billie Godfrey has been an integral part of HEAVEN 17’s live line-up since their comeback supporting ERASURE in 1997.
Oozing charm and sensuality, Billie’s obvious on-stage chemistry with lead vocalist Glenn Gregory has been a wonderfully entertaining aspect to any HEAVEN 17 show.
Her interpretation of the classic ‘Temptation’ (a ‘Versions 08’ reworking of which is included on the album ‘Naked As Advertised’) has brought the song into the 21st Century while still retaining its soulful passion. Her voice has also provided a powerful human counterpoint to some of the more electronic material on this year’s ‘Penthouse and Pavement’ tour.
Having served HEAVEN 17 for nearly 13 years, Ms Godfrey is busier than ever. As well as further shows on UK leg of the ‘Penthouse and Pavement’ tour, she is a much in demand session singer and has supported soul star Beverley Knight as well as being part of her band for several years.
ELECTRICITYCLUB.CO.UK caught up with Billie Godfrey during a break in her hectic schedule to talk about her work with Messrs Gregory, Ware and Marsh, and her new solo album.
You’ve been singing with HEAVEN 17 since they started playing live in 1997. How did this first come about?
I was singing sessions for various artists at the time and got a call to go along and meet the guys as they wanted two female vocalists for their live gigs. I went along and met them in Martyn’s studio and sang a few parts for them to listen to my voice – it was a fairly casual set up – I remember sitting with a cup of tea in my hand when Martyn said “the thing is, we need someone who can do the high notes in ‘Temptation'” – I had been a fan of the song for years so just sang along with it sitting in the chair and as I’ve naturally got a high range, I was comfortable with the top notes… I think Mart said something like “well that’s that sorted then!”.
I didn’t really perform it as such but with the guys knowing voices the way they do, they could tell I could handle it and I think we just hit it off as friends and they knew I’d be easy to work with which is important when you spend time on the road together.
You must really enjoy working with the boys because you’re still here and you also co-wrote the excellent ‘Are You Ready’? with them for their most recent album ‘Before After’?
I do love working with Martyn and Glenn (as well as Ian when he was on the scene). If you’ve seen / heard them interviewed, you’ll know that they’re quick witted, funny and very clever. Musically I’m still fascinated by their work which sometimes seems so leftfield lyrically (which is refreshing in a world of the bland regurgitation of old ideas). Mostly I’m drawn to the elements of soul and funk within the music which is more where I fit in as I’m a soul singer.
I’m glad you asked about ‘Are You Ready?’ which I’m very proud of as a co-write. The guys gave me a backing track and I wrote the top line melody and lyrics. I tried to get under the skin of their lyrical style; a little off-kilter and unpredictable; it’s essentially a love song but there’s a slavish servant to master/penitent soul to preacher idea behind it with the spurned lover almost begging to be redeemed or converted by the object of their desire. I got a real buzz hearing Glenn sing the lines I’d penned; it was just how I imagined it sounding with his great voice. I think there’s more mileage to be had in that song and my ideal would be to hear Elly from LA ROUX and Glenn sing it as a duet – what do you reckon?
Yes, that would be really interesting! So what are your own favourite HEAVEN 17 songs?
All too obvious perhaps but ‘Temptation’ is my runaway favourite – as a singer it’s one of those great vehicles to get your teeth (or voice) into and really give it some. I also love the recent tour version of ‘Height Of The Fighting’ we’ve been doing – the beat just gets right under my skin and although there’s not lots in it vocally for me to do, I loved having a groove onstage to that one. It’s one of many of HEAVEN 17’s tunes with a delicious groove.
You’ve appeared with HEAVEN 17 on TV shows like ITV’s Now That’s What I Call 1983 singing ‘Temptation’ and BBC6 Music’s HEAVEN 17 / LA ROUX session plus more recently, the Sheffield Magna concert broadcast on BBC2. What was it like to be involved in these programmes and how does it feel to be recognised by the general public afterwards?
Well now, I don’t generally get recognised after TV appearances which I’m happy with as I can get on with my life!
I am known at Beverley Knight (who I’ve also been with for 8 years) and HEAVEN 17 gigs by fans and that’s nice; it’s like meeting up with a certain set of friends. With me, it’s more often the case that people I already know will say they saw me on TV and my extended friends and family can see that I’m still alive and well.
I’m no stranger to TV appearances in my work as a session singer with various artists and have sung on TV for Beverley Knight, Sting, Annie Lennox, Paulo Nutini, Tom Jones, Lionel Richie and many others. There’s a certain unreality about TV performance as the audience in the studio seems small while in reality it can be a few million people that see it.
I enjoy the challenge of holding my nerve which is really important if it’s a lead vocal – being nervous affects your breathing so you have to keep it together. I really loved doing the Now ’83 programme as basically I’m a show off and love taking centre stage. I like people to hear my voice too as I feel I’m lucky to have it and it’s my responsibility to share it with others. The LA ROUX performance felt more like a radio in-session and that means you take even more care of the sound you’re making rather than worrying about the visual impact. The whole thing felt cool and relaxed and the small audience gave us a lot of love and made it feel like we were all at something a bit special.
It’s been fantastic to hear the ‘Penthouse and Pavement’ album live on this recent tour. Were you familiar with it before you started working with HEAVEN 17 and how did you manage to learn all the words to the songs? Do you have a particular method to help prompt you?
I’ve loved doing the ‘Penthouse and Pavement’ songs – I did know the album but not as well as ‘The Luxury Gap’ which was more my era. I love the artwork and have an old vinyl copy at home. Learning lyrics is something I have to do a lot of and the lyric remembering part of my brain is huge and has squashed out everything else – that’s why I can’t do Sudoku! Preparation is everything and if there’s not enough time, I do sometimes take notes on stage but mostly I try to learn lyrics when I’m relaxed, just before bed is good.
I sometimes re-write them so I can visualize how they looked on the page and recall them like that or do drawings to give me clues. The main drawing I add is an eye which means “watch out for this bit coming up” if I’ve had trouble learning one bit.
So how was it to step into Tina Turner’s high heels on the BEF cover ‘Ball Of Confusion’?
I think Tina’s a size 6 and a half and I’m a 5… her voice cannot be bettered for power and raw guts. My voice is sweeter but I can belt when I want to so I hope I added something of my own. The rhythm of that tune is everything and I listened back to The Temptations’ original to get my vibe on it. The lyrical content is serious and still relevant today – it shares a lot of the sentiment of one of my songs called Allergic To The World so I hope I give it the emotional weight it deserves.
Who were the singers who originally inspired you?
Stevie Wonder, Minnie Riperton, Donny Hathaway and Joni Mitchell as well as Anita Baker who I saw live at Wembley and decided there and then that I HAD to be a singer. It’s all her fault!
Apart from HEAVEN 17, what other musical projects that you have got going on at the moment?
I have a solo album just out called ‘The Eden Tree. This is my most important project as it is me as an artist expressing what I want to say musically and lyrically, and it is what I would most like to be known for.
It’s twelve original songs written or co-written by me plus two covers ‘Woodstock’ by Joni Mitchell and ‘You’ve Got A Friend’ by Carole King. ‘The Eden Tree’ is being received well so far but there’s still a long way to go though. So any fans out there who can spread the word, get twittering please!
I’ve already opened for Beverley Knight on her 100% UK tour with songs from the album which culminated in playing the Royal Albert Hall, London in April. There are YouTube clips of the gig on my website and I’ll think you’d be surprised how different it is to HEAVEN 17……
Martyn Ware and his family really like ‘The Eden Tree’ and have it playing regularly in their car so that’s a good start! Beverley and Martyn have both likened it to Minnie Riperton which is a great compliment; it’s also influenced by Joni Mitchell and Stevie Wonder. And if you have Eva Cassidy, Ray Lamontagne and Norah Jones in your CD collection, ‘The Eden Tree’ would sit pretty well on the same shelf I think. I write music the way I listen to it; sometimes mellow, sometimes really uptempo.
I am also the co-writer and lead singer of a Latin fusion band called SAO BENITEZ – they have song being used for the Bacardi worldwide advertising campaign at the moment and there are two albums coming out in June called ‘Feeling High’ and ‘Peace & Love’ which I’m really proud of. The music is mainly uptempo Latin with some soul.
And finally, is it true you are the first Western artist to have recorded a whole album entirely in Japanese?
Good question – I’ve seen that on Wikipedia and I have to say I don’t know if it’s true or not. I certainly did record an album in Japanese which is out on JVC Japan called ‘Number One’.
It was mostly original songs, although there’s a cover of Minnie Riperton’s ‘Loving You’ on there. I would like to think I was the first but I don’t know – Wikipedia don’t always get everything right – it also says I’m a keyboard player which isn’t true – I can play enough to write songs, but you won’t catch me playing at a gig anytime soon!
The album was the idea of producer Mark Summers and I really enjoyed making it. The album has a character of its own which is quite young with a pop/R’n’B feel and is very different to my current solo album which (aside from being in English) represents me much more truthfully as a mature artist and songwriter.
ELECTRICITYCLUB.CO.UK gives its warmest thanks to Billie Godfrey
BILLIE GODFREY’s album ‘The Eden Tree’ is available to download on iTunes while CDs can be purchased via her website
BBC2 will be broadcasting HEAVEN 17’s 30th Anniversary ‘Penthouse and Pavement’ concert in Sheffield and a special documentary on the album this weekend.
The documentary is the story of the band, the city and the album that gave birth to British new wave of electronic pop in late 70s Sheffield. It also follows the band as they prepare to perform the album entirely live for the very first time. With economic recession decimating their industrial heartland, aspirational computer operators Martyn Ware and Ian Craig Marsh experimented with newly affordable synthesisers from Korg and Roland to create sounds in their first band THE HUMAN LEAGUE that would eventually form part of a new musical movement.
When the band split in Autumn 1980, Martyn and Ian formed a production company called the BRITISH ELECTRIC FOUNDATION (BEF) and released ‘Music For Stowaways’, an instrumental album only available on cassette that foresaw the advent of modern day iPod headphone culture.
One of the BEF projects was a pop group named HEAVEN 17 after the fictitious band in ‘A Clockwork Orange’ and for this they recruited singer and old friend Glenn Gregory. ‘Penthouse and Pavement’ was their first album released in 1981. It was a landmark achievement, combining electronics with pop hooks and funky disco sounds while adding witty social and political commentary.
Photo by Tracey Welch
Due to technological constraints the band were unable to perform the album live but also had no desire to join the touring circuit. However, with the advances in technology, the album was performed for the first time to a sell-out gig of over 2000 people at the Sheffield Magna on 6 March 2010. As well as performing ‘Penthouse and Pavement’ in its entirety, they played several BEF tracks from the period such as their cover of LOU REED’s ‘Perfect Day’ as well as their hits ‘Temptation’ and ‘Let Me Go’.
During a short break from the editing suite at the BBC, Glenn Gregory took time out to talk to ELECTRICITYCLUB.CO.UK about this seminal album, playing live and doing acoustic HUMAN LEAGUE covers…
After playing a couple of British dates and undertaking a European tour earlier this year, HEAVEN 17 are taking the ‘Penthouse and Pavement’ show on a full UK jaunt in the Autumn. You went through the beginning of your career of not playing live at all. You’re a great live act but do you ever wish you’d done this much sooner and do you think HEAVEN 17’s career might have turned out differently if you had?
It’s almost impossible to say really… things I’m sure would have been different but for better or worse, who can say? I have no regrets about not playing live back in the day. We had a great time making records, making videos, travelling around the world doing television shows, working with interesting people it was a dream… maybe the dream might have been enhanced by touring, but then again it may have turned into a nightmare.
‘Penthouse and Pavement’ had quite a unique sound with the synthesizer technology combined with the American influenced funk on one side and what appeared to be a development of THE HUMAN LEAGUE’s ‘Travelogue’ on the other. Had this been a conscious decision or had this been forced on you as you were maybe unsure about which direction to pursue?
It was a definite decision. We wanted a little distance between what THE HUMAN LEAGUE had been and probably were still going to be, and what HEAVEN 17 were about to become. The balance in any group is obviously changed when anyone leaves or joins… things were naturally heading in a different direction just by the very fact that the dynamic of the group had changed.
I suppose the real turning point was when we had written ‘Fascist Groove Thang’ (only about ten days after THE HUMAN LEAGUE had split) and Martyn had suggested we put a bass guitar solo in the middle breakdown… a great idea but we didn’t know any bass players. A little bit of fortune later and in walked the young John Wilson to our studio… the rest is history. The new sound was found and we were on our way to making a unique album.
How do you feel about your baby still having such a powerful resonance in today’s world after all this time, particularly songs like the title track, ‘Let’s All Make A Bomb’, ‘Height Of The Fighting’ and ‘We’re Going To Live For A Very Long Time’?
Some things will always be relevant. We wrote about subjects that touched our lives and our souls, things that mattered not just to us as individuals but also to us as a part of a political or social system. We never preached and always (I hope) ranted with wit and humour. They were political times (as indeed is now) and the album reflected those times and I believe as you say, some of those songs are still very relevant today.
Photo by Tracey Welch
The Sheffield Magna gig really was something special and has been filmed for prosperity, along with a BBC2 documentary on the band. How does it feel to finally get this kind of recognition for your contribution to popular culture?
Well the gig I don’t know if I shall ever see, because I really find it very hard indeed to watch myself perform! I’m ok listening but doubt I could watch…
However I am very proud of that night and the show we put together and am grateful for all the hard work and love that our friends put into it to make it happen. And I suppose when I’m 106 and sitting in a sedan chair on the balcony of my Italian villa in Umbria, I may well gesture to my young and pretty nurse to bring forth the 3D television and finally sneak a peak at the ‘Penthouse and Pavement’ show.
The documentary I have already seen as I have been involved with the editing and I love it… its honest, funny and true. Watch it, you’ll like it I promise.
The live renditions of the BEF ‘Music Of Quality and Distinction’ covers were great and it was fantastic to hear ‘I’m Your Money’ live at last. How was it for you to perform these cult HEAVEN 17 classics?
It was great to perform those BEF songs and some of the rare never ever to be played live tracks… I have been trying to work out a way to perform ‘I’m Your Money’ for ages with no success and when Martyn suggested doing in the ‘Penthouse and Pavement’ set, I said “can’t be done”… clever bastard did though, I loved it.
Photo by Glenn Gregory
Are there any other songs you’d like to feature in the live set at some point that haven’t been performed before?
Ooo lots… ‘And That’s No Lie’, Elly from LA ROUX insists we must do the full album version of this one day, I promised her we will… ‘Sunset Now’, oh my god all the tracks off ‘The Luxury Gap’ that we have never done… ‘Lady Ice And Mr Hex’, one of my all time favourites.Really now we have started, I don’t think anything will stop us… all donations gratefully received
I understand Phil Oakey was watching you do ‘Being Boiled’ in Sheffield! Has he ever told you what he thought of your take on it?
He was and he has actually said he liked it. I wished Phil would have come on stage. I would have loved to hand him the mike and sang BVs. I love THE HUMAN LEAGUE.
I thought the acoustic rendition of ‘Don’t You Want Me?’ in Cologne after the electronic drum kit broke down was hilarious! I didn’t know you could even play guitar; you kept that well hidden in the past!
Yes… a little known secret now out in the open, I hope it doesn’t harm my electronic credentials too much! It was a fantastic night in Cologne, the longest set by far. I think I did 3 or 4 acoustic songs… the guitar’s a definite must from now on… that bloody electronic drum kit is a bit fragile! Still it made for a very unique show.
You’re headlining the first night of Bestival for ‘Back To The Phuture’ in September. HEAVEN 17 aren’t known as a festival act so are you ready for it? Will you approach Bestival differently to your own shows? And will you be camping for the night?
First of all, No Camping! I am really looking forward to it though and may well do the gig in fancy dress… Mart said he might do it as Roy Wood from Wizzard and I might go as Noddy Holder! Please let the sun shine
The BBC6 Music ‘Back To The Phuture’ live session with LA ROUX was brilliant; you looked like you were really enjoying it. ‘In For The Kill’ really did sound like a lost HEAVEN 17 song with you singing it. How do you feel about the success of the new generation of electronic based acts and are they’re any others who you like?
I loved singing with LA ROUX, Elly is a star… she is so charismatic to watch on stage… she’s hypnotic… it was a honour to perform with her. I would love to work with her and Ben Langmaid in the future… we got on so well. I have always loved electronic music and there are too many bands to mention really… I’m just pleased the movement is so strong and productive.
Apart from the ‘Penthouse and Pavement’ UK shows in the autumn, what else is happening with HEAVEN 17? Are there any plans for any new material?
We’re playing quite a few gigs through the summer then we have the ‘Penthouse and Pavement’ tour at the end of the year so for this year, that’s gonna keep us quite busy. But I could never say there will never be another HEAVEN 17 album… in fact if I were a betting man I’d get down the bookies and have a tanner on another one coming this way one day soon!
ELECTRICITYCLUB.CO.UK gives its sincerest thanks to Glenn Gregory
With special thanks to Peter Noble and David Stanbury
‘HEAVEN 17 Live in Concert’ will be broadcast on BBC2 on Sunday 16th May 2010 at 11.30pm while ‘HEAVEN 17: The Story of Penthouse and Pavement’ will be broadcast on BBC2 on Monday 17th May 2010 at 11.20pm
HEAVEN 17’s 30th Anniversary Penthouse And Pavement Tour
Dates include Edinburgh HMV Picture House (Nov 22), Glasgow O2 ABC (Nov 23), Manchester Ritz (Nov 25), Birmingham HMV Institute (Nov 26), London HMV Forum (Nov 28), Oxford O2 Academy (Nov 29), Brighton Corn Exchange (Nov 30), Bristol O2 Academy (Dec 1)
Please visit www.heaven17.com for details of the forthcoming ‘Penthouse & Pavement’ UK Tour in Autumn 2010
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The second example brought new life to a track that even in its regular seven inch format remains one of the most endearing tunes from the ’80s. 
by Rob Grillo is published by Bank House Books
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