JOHN FRYER is the renowned producer, engineer and musician who was also a member of THIS MORTAL COIL.
He cut his teeth with Daniel Miller and Eric Radcliffe at the legendary Blackwing Studios co-engineering the first recordings of FAD GADGET. Fryer achieved mainstream success when he was asked to co-engineer a fledgling synthesizer band who had just signed to Mute Records. That band was of course DEPECHE MODE and he was involved in their run of Top 40 singles between ‘New Life’ and ‘Leave In Silence’.
Fryer also co-engineered YAZOO’s debut long player ‘Upstairs At Eric’s’. He soon used his engineering experience to become a producer in his own right, working with COCTEAU TWINS, MODERN ENGLISH, SWANS and NINE INCH NAILS.
Simultaneously, he was also the only constant along with 4AD founder Ivo Watts-Russell in the musical art collective THIS MORTAL COIL who featured Elizabeth Fraser, Lisa Gerrard and Alison Limerick among its highly regarded cast of guest vocalists.
He also recorded with STRIPMALL ARCHITECTURE singer Rebecca Coseboomas as DARKDRIVECLINIC, releasing an album ‘Noise In My Head’ in 2011.
His latest project is SILVER GHOST SHIMMER with vocalist Pinky Turzo, the sound of which is described as “inspired from the vocal groups of the 60s like THE SHANGRI-LAS with a twist of Glamour and Decay to their Sugar Coated Noise Pop Couture”.
Fryer will be making appearance at ‘A Secret Wish’ on SUNDAY 19TH APRIL 2015 in London with a special DJ set that will cover the range of his work for 4AD and Mute.
Hosted by Nordic friendly blog Cold War Night Life, ‘A Secret Wish’ follows on from the success of last March’s ‘An Evening With The Swedish Synth’; the line-up will also feature live sets from SISTA MANNEN PÅ JORDEN and VILE ELECTRODES.
JOHN FRYER kindly chatted to ELECTRICITYCLUB.CO.UK about his varied career and what he may have in store for his DJ set at ‘A Secret Wish’…
How did you first become acquainted with recording synthesizers?
Well, that’s an easy question, as soon as I walked through door of the studio for my 1st recording sessions, as it was Daniel Miller making a SILICON TEENS song.
You first become known co-engineering FAD GADGET with Eric Radcliffe. What are your memories of being in the studio with Frank Tovey and do you have any particular favourite tracks of his?
It was great working with Fad (Frank) even though he was making electronic music; he had a punk ethos, so anything goes. One of my best memories of Fad was, he was doing a song called ‘The Box’ and he wanted to have a claustrophobic vocal sound, so we recorded him in a box (well, a flight case) to get the boxy close sound.
What did you think when you were first presented with DEPECHE MODE by Daniel Miller?
They were four very shy guys and Daniel thought they were the future of synth pop, and he was right.
The sounds on the ‘Speak & Spell’ album sit neatly within the mix. Did they require much treatment or did you get the opportunity to give feedback and suggestions to Daniel or Vince as they programmed?
‘Speak & Spell’ was made on a 8 track tape machine, so lot of tracks had to be recorded together onto one track, or bounced together once they had been recorded, we didn’t have the luxury of what you had today in the digital world. So a lot of time and careful planning had to go into the recordings.
What was your own preferred or most flexible synthesizer during your time at Blackwing Studios?
That’s a hard question, but one of my favourite things was the sampler when it came out, as it opened up so many new doors of how to record and anything that made a noise became a new instrument.
By ‘A Broken Frame’, the equipment became more sophisticated with things like the PPG Wave 2, Simmons drums and Roland TR808. What were those like to work with?
Technology was moving so fast in the 80s and it was great to be working with Daniel Miller, because as soon as there was a new synth or drum machine out, Daniel would bring it into the studio.
I remember Daniel driving out to Roger Linn’s place to pick up one of the first Linn Drum Machines so we could use it on the album.
You also co-engineered YAZOO’s ‘Upstairs at Eric’s’ at around the same time, how different was this compared to working with DEPECHE MODE? Did you get embroiled in any of the tensions at the time?
It was so different working with Vince and Depeche. Vince wanted to go super pop, he wanted to be the new ABBA and Depeche now with Martin writing wanted to go darker. They both wanted to record at the same time and it was best they were kept apart, so Eric decided to make a new studio in his house for Vince, hence ‘Upstairs at Eric’s’. Why it was called upstairs I don’t know, as the studio was on the ground floor?? I stayed working at Blackwing with the other three.
You went on to produce COCTEAU TWINS, as a well being a member of THIS MORTAL COIL. How were you achieving those ethereal textures that were predominantly sourced from using guitars rather than synths?
By the time 4AD started using the studio on a regular basis, the AMS RMX16 Digital Reverb had been made and it became my trade mark sound on the 4AD records. As for guitar sounds, a lot of the sounds come from Boss Pedals, so everything was saturated with FXs so you couldn’t really hear the source sound and had no idea if it was keyboards or guitar. Still doing the same today…
Did Elizabeth Fraser have any vocal techniques that presented an interesting challenge for you as a producer?
No, Elizabeth is a great singer, no problem with her voice… it’s just that she was so shy, it was painful to see her struggling with her shyness at times, but once she started singing everything was fine.
You co-produced on NINE INCH NAILS’ debut long player ‘Pretty Hate Machine’. What was Trent Reznor like to work with and was that focus and single minded determination that he is known for now, present in him even then?
It was great working with Trent, we had fun pushing the envelope. We tried to make the album as hard as possible at the time of recording.
We were very proud of the sound of the record and couldn’t wait to play it to the head of the label (Steve Gottlieb) when he came by the studio.
After listening to the play back of the album, his face was full of horror and his mouth was wide open and all he could say was, “you have ruined this record” so we were super happy with that… job well done.
Which recordings that you have worked on, are you most proud and why?
Well of course, my album by DARKDRIVECLINIC and my soon-to-be released album by SILVER GHOST SHIMMER, you can check out our new video of ‘Soft Landing’ on Youtube….
What can people expect from your DJ set at ‘A Secret Wish’?
It will be a pimped up set of 4AD and Mute tracks like you’ve never heard them before, and the only way you can hear the tracks like this is when I DJ them.
ELECTRICITYCLUB.CO.UK gives it grateful thanks to JOHN FRYER
With additional thanks to Simon Helm at Cold War Night Life
JOHN FRYER will be appearing at ‘A Secret Wish’ hosted by Cold War Night Life on SUNDAY 19TH APRIL 2015 at The Lexington, 96-98 Pentonville Road, London N1 9JB. Playing live will be SISTA MANNEN PÅ JORDEN and VILE ELECTRODES.
With the decline in physical music sales and the pressure on artists to generate revenue from the live shows, the paying public now has much higher expectations when it comes to seeing a band live.
With gig ticket prices rising steadily and the re-sale market taken into consideration too, the desire to see your favourite band often sees your bank account taking a serious hit.
For that reason you would have right to expect value for money, not just in terms of show length, but how the visuals are presented. The image of NINE INCH NAILS (from both a design aesthetic and the act as a live experience) has shown just how much Trent Reznor cares about the visual identity of the band – with the birth of the ‘Tension’ tour in 2013, it was his intention to create a show which created a film-like experience for the audience, that “started off one-way and then musically and visually evolves to keep your attention”.
Prior to their retirement in 2006, the NIN live experience back then was often a sensory overload, with the band playing behind a large net screen for some songs with huge projected images overload on top of them. This was taken a stage further on the initial ‘Tension’ dates using an innovative LED curtain which dropped in front of the band upon which computer generated graphics could be overlayed.
Unfortunately, this element of the show has been dropped for this part of tour, but even without this, the tour really sets the standard for how live electronic / rock music should be put across with Reznor investing a huge amount of his own money into the lighting so that it fulfilled his vision. What is also interesting is how fluid this process is.
For some acts, it would be tempting to stick to a winning formula and use the same lights and songs for a long world tour, but at the risk of the process becoming playing by numbers after several dates. On this tour, songs are regularly rotated, so for the fan happy to follow the band and catch several dates, there is the added bonus that it remains a fresh show experience for them too.
Joining Reznor onstage are long-term cohorts Robin Fincke and Alessandro Cortini, sadly missed however was the legendary Pino Palladino who played some 2013 dates. But his shoes were ably filled by Cortini, Fincke and drummer Ilan Rubin who were interchangeable on their instruments, switching effortlessly between guitars, synth and bass throughout the evening.
Tonight’s show gave the band an opportunity to showcase material from all stages of their career, with the more recent material from ‘Hesitation Marks’ slotting in well alongside older tracks from ‘Pretty Hate Machine’ and ‘The Downward Spiral’. Opening track ‘Somewhat Damaged’ from ‘The Fragile’opened the show, its ascending four note guitar riff giving way to layers of electronics and pounding drums from Rubin.
At a NIN show there are some songs you are guaranteed to hear, early on this included the now familiar one-two sequence of ‘March Of The Pigs’ and ‘Pigs’, despite the thematic link, both tracks polar opposites of each other, the first being a dynamic call to arms, the second a slower, loping, more melodic track.
With ‘The Great Destroyer’, NIN turned the Nottingham Arena into one massive club venue, with Reznor and Cortez both behind a bank of electronics, warping and glitching the extended outro for the song, silhouetted against a shifting LED backdrop. Fan favourites ‘Closer’, ‘Hand That Feeds’ and ‘Head Like A Hole’ were saved for the latter part of the set, before the band closed the show with ‘Hurt’; despite nearly being ruined by a mass out of time clap-along, this as always proved to be the perfect gig closer.
An anthemic yet, brutally honest song famously covered by Johnny Cash, it was a crashing climax sealing an astonishing show. Although not quite measuring up to the last RAMMSTEIN tour in terms of being an out-and-out jaw-dropping spectacle, this tour has raised the bar for how electronic and rock music should be presented live.
The instrumentation was perfect, live drums were used when they were needed and not added in to try and reinforce that “we are now A ROCK BAND” a la current DEPECHE MODE, plus there was barely any audience communication as it wasn’t needed; the music and the visuals on show did all the talking.
The only negative that could be applied to tonight’s gig is that having seen footage of the earlier ‘Tension’ shows, these ones are certainly stripped back in terms of budget and lack the variation of the moving screens. The original references to TALKING HEADS iconic ‘Stop Making Sense’ are sadly gone too, probably a financial decision, as it has become apparent in interviews that the earlier full-blown shows, despite being completely mind blowing were losing money due to the production costs involved. Even taking all of this into account, this is a tour that people will be talking about for several years to come, a real sonic and visual treat for the senses.
The best way to sum up this show review is to leave you with a few words from REPUBLICA vocalist Saffron who witnessed the London O2 Arena date: “Now that’s how it’s done..! NINE INCH NAILS were amazing at O2. Extraordinary sound and lights. If your ambition isn’t to present your music as well as this, give up……”
NINE INCH NAILS tour North America throughout Summer 2014
If there is one man who has put the synthesizer on the map within popular music, it is Gary Numan.
Under the moniker of TUBEWAY ARMY, his memorable appearance on ‘Top Of The Pops’ in May 1979 with ‘Are Friends Electric?’ became many a music fan’s entry point into electronic music. The huge international hit ‘Cars’ swiftly followed and with it, worldwide fame and fortune.
The outstanding legacy of those two songs has put Numan is an awkward position, particularly in the UK where mainstream media only want to feature and talk about those two songs.
But by the same token in the last 20 years or so, ‘Cars’ in particular has been particularly lucrative, having been used in commercials for Carling, American Express, Nissan and Churchill.
This has allowed Numan to pursue his own distinctive and heavier path with albums such as ‘Exile’ and the critically acclaimed ‘Pure’. In a career of over 35 years with well documented highs and lows, it is Numan’s highs that have established him as a highly influential music figure. Covers of his songs by heavyweights such as NINE INCH NAILS, FOO FIGHTERS and Marilyn Manson have been indicators of the high regard by which the former Gary Webb is held.
But is it not just the murkier world of alternative rock that has acknowledged its debt to Numan. Even in the dance and pop world where tales of dystopia and icy alienation are not easily embraced, samples of ‘Are Friends Electric?’, ‘Cars’ and ‘M.E.’ have respectively formed the basis of massive hit singles by SUGABABES, ARMAND VAN HELDEN and BASEMENT JAXX.
Gary Numan’s new album ‘Splinter (Songs From A Broken Mind)’ is the follow-up to 2004’s ‘Jagged’. Although 2011 saw the release of the out takes collection ‘Dead Son Rising’, ‘Splinter’ is Numan’s first full length album project for seven years.
Produced by Ade Fenton and mastered by Matt Colton, the album features amongst its guest musicians guitarist Robin Finck, best known for his work with NINE INCH NAILS.
It sees a reinvigorated Numan in dynamic form, experimenting with classical orchestration on ‘The Calling’ and a more vulnerable but soulful vocal style on ‘Lost’ that will be a fresh surprise to anyone remotely interested in his work.
Dark dubdrops and spaces provide the much needed variation from previous works while sitting alongside are blistering anthemic synth assisted rockers like ‘Who Are You?’ and ‘Love Hurt Bleed’. With the opening gambit of ‘I Am Dust’ as a formidable statement of intent and the beautifully dramatic ‘My Last Day’ as its closer, ‘Splinter (Songs From A Broken Mind)’ is possibly Numan’s most significant work since 2000’s ‘Pure’.
Gary Numan kindly took time out to chat to from his new home in LA where he was in good spirits despite his wife Gemma’s illness at the time…
‘Splinter’ is finally upon us…it’s been a long journey?
It’s f***ing ridiculous isn’t it? *laughs*
It hasn’t taken 7 years to make; it’s just been 7 years since the last one! Half of it was written in the last 8 months since I moved to LA. A bit was in the 6 months before the move but the bulk of it was written in the last year and a half plus there were some of it that came from various half hearted attempts at the start… I’d probably got about 30-35 songs in the course of that 7 years but never got stuck into it until the last year or so.
There are many reasons for that; shortly after ‘Jagged’ we had a baby which was really cool; but then we had another unexpectedly and then another shortly after! So our life went from being fairly free, easy and hedonistic to suddenly having a family where your life’s not your own anymore! I, in particular didn’t adapt to the family thing very well at all!
I really love the children but the life that came with them I did not love at all… I really missed my old life. I’d turned 50 and was having a mid-life crisis; I got really panicky about dying and getting illnesses, weird paranoia, crying in the streets when I saw old people… I properly weirded myself out! So I went on anti-depressants, Gemma had post-natal depression from the second baby right through to our third so she had a terrible time. We both struggled with the responsibility of parenting and its fears, so we were both at our worst when we needed to be strong for each other. We started to have problems and it was horrible!
The last thing I wanted to do was start another album. I do them quite challenging I have to say. I find each one more difficult than the one before… the emotional rollercoaster that you go on!
They’re massively important to your life and to your future so it’s very easy to become overly self-critical and to have confidence issues. If I have a bad day in the studio, it has a terrible effect on me and it’s hard to keep positive. And that has a knock-on effect on your family. So you grate on each other again.
Luckily, we worked all through that and we’ve come out of it stronger than ever. I‘ve adapted to family life and it’s brilliant, I love it… we are honestly stronger than ever. We loved each other and got through it. I started working on the album more seriously but by now I had the children and they were massively distracting. I didn’t want to miss anything and so I spent far too much time being a dad. So when I got used to be a dad, I spent far too much time doing that rather than being a songwriter!
But then, the album started to go really well and I found because of all the sh*t we’d gone through, I had a huge amount of things to write about. So songs like ‘Lost’ and ‘The Calling’, they’re not the happiest of tunes to be really honest, but it all came from a very difficult time! Food for creativity! *laughs*
How did the momentum for finishing ‘Splinter’ begin?
I actually did get a lot of confidence from ‘Dead Son Rising’ because that had its own problems; Ade bullied me into finishing that! *laughs*
It’s entirely to Ade’s credit that album ever happened because he was trying to do that while this sh*t was going on. At one point I said “I don’t like it” and I turned my back on it for a year and a half! I only rediscovered it by accident when we were on holiday; Gemma was playing a track in another room and I didn’t recognise it… I thought it sounded great!
So I went running to her and said “What’s that? It’s brilliant! If I’d written that stuff, I’d be writing albums” and she went “…it is you, YOU F***ING IDIOT!” – she said it was the ‘Dead Son Rising’ stuff that I didn’t like! I didn’t even recognise it and I went “I was wrong then because that’s really good!”*laughs*
So I rang Ade up and apologised about being so stupid so that we could finish the album. I suddenly did a whole load of work and got it done. I ended up being really proud of it. It got great reviews and the fans liked it. But I still didn’t throw myself wholeheartedly into ‘Splinter’ as it still felt like a huge project but that was the turning point. And when I came to LA, I built a new home studio and my work ethic was like I was 21 again. I was in there every day churning stuff out. The children were forbidden from even knocking on the door… as soon as I turned a machine on, a red light went on outside so they knew! I hadn’t been that efficient before!
Had ‘The Fall’, which was on ‘Dead Son Rising’, originally been intended for ‘Splinter’?
No, that was a demo from ‘Jagged’ or ‘Pure’. ‘Dead Son Rising’ had started out as a collection of stuff I hadn’t released. It ended up being mainly new songs funnily enough but that was the way it worked out.
Often you will write a song but decide not to put it on an album, not because it’s a bad song but it doesn’t quite suit that album. So you put it on a shelf and normally, you forget all about it. It was only a few years ago that I started keeping stuff I didn’t use, I used to erase everything!
Ade was round my house and asked whether I had any unreleased stuff. We went to the studio and found about 14-15 songs that we thought were good that were of a similar vein we could use. So when I got back from holiday, I wrote some new stuff so it ended up an album of more new songs but ‘The Fall’ and ‘When The Sky Bleeds He Will Come’ were definitely old ones.
On first listening, although it’s still heavy, ‘Splinter’ appears to be a lot more freer, looser than ‘Jagged’ with more variation?
I think that’s true. It’s far more varied than ‘Jagged’ and ‘Pure’, more variation in tempo, it doesn’t hammer on about God the way the last few have done! I learnt a lot from ‘Dead Son Rising’ because my original idea was really bad.
I was just going to make 12 songs, everyone of them was going to be a huge anthemic singalong epic… aural assault, brain damage, all that kind of thing! Then when ‘Dead Son Rising’ came out, that was very varied and I thought that was actually much more interesting from a songwriting point of view. A lot of the fan and media reaction commented on the fact that it was varied compared to what I’d done before.
So when I started to work on ‘Splinter’ in earnest, that became a requirement that we wouldn’t do this one-dimensional idea I’d envisaged. We did the opposite and made it more varied. We were careful about what songs we chose to make sure that we had that. I honestly think it’s a much better album to the one before it, a much more interesting listening experience than if I’d have stuck with my original idea… which was a sh*t idea! *laughs*
‘I Am Dust’ is a terrific opener that is a lot more electronic than some were expecting? Some have reflected it’s thematically close to ‘We Are Glass’…
We definitely moved away from guitars but they’re still on it; Robin Finck’s on it for a start, he’s one of the best guitar players in the world. But it’s an emphasis thing. On the previous albums, it’s shifted very much towards guitars being very prominent but this one is very much on electronic music… some songs don’t have any guitars on at all! It’s still the same mixture of instrumentation as before but the emphasis is different.
I don’t think I play guitar on any songs at all on ‘Splinter’… I may have done on the demos but not on the finished versions. It was a conscious decision right from the outset to make a more electronic album. But we still wanted it to be heavy and that industrial rock vibe running through it.
Arabic overtones come into the atmospheres of your work quite a bit now like on the ‘Splinter’ title track?
I’ve actually wanted to make an Arabian kind of album, that sort of vibe, for a long time but never actually done it. What I have done with ‘Splinter’ is sprinkled it over top of some of the songs. I really love it, some of the instrumentation in particular, the structures and the melody flows are beautiful, very atmospheric and emotional. And I do think it translates quite well to the sort of thing I do, I think it works. I just haven’t had the courage yet to go into it wholeheartedly, I’m still cowardly tinkering round the edges of it. But on this album, it’s more than I’ve done before but it’s still very much just a flavour like a gentle herb drizzled across the top.
Photo by Keith Martin
That’s interesting that you mention beauty, because it’s not necessarily been a term used to describe your work…
…but there’s always been melody; if you strip out all of the heaviness, quite often what you’re left with is quite pretty melodies.
I really noticed that on the ‘Jagged’ album. During the sessions, we would strip the songs back down to piano and the melodies were quite pretty.
But it’s the way we produce them that makes them heavy. You could take them in a very different way and have a beautiful album. I think a lot of that is true on ‘Splinter’.
If you listen to the song ‘Lost’, we deliberately haven’t produced that… it’s stayed sparse and naked; essentially it’s just a piano and a vocal all the way through it. The quality of the melody on that really shows because it’s undisguised. I think it’s the thing I’m best at from the melody point of view… it’s my only string point! I’m not a particularly good musician truth be told and Ade is by far a better producer than I’ve ever been. But melody is probably the one thing that I can do.
The vocal on ‘Lost’ intrigued me because it’s kind of… soulful?
Me and Ade had so many arguments about this! *laughs*
Ade decided and I reluctantly agreed to put the vocal on with virtually no effects on it whatsoever. When I used to make albums up to ‘Jagged’, I put a lot of effect on my voice because I’ve never been confident about it. I didn’t think it was very good and I would put double tracking on it, delays, reverbs… I would just swamp the f***er!
Ade and Gemma had been saying for ages that I should let the voice come out on its own and louder in the mix. So we have done it and it’s very reduced effects, one or two delays and gentle reverb. There’s no ADT, no harmonising which was my in-the-pocket effect for whatever I did… that’s all gone! And so to my ears, it’s horribly naked and I’m really uncomfortable about it! *laughs*
Photo by Keith Trigwell
‘Love Hurt Bleed’ is a good hybrid of guitars and electronics, a real highlight… did you change the ‘Splinter’ songs much from having played them live?
Not a lot, they were pretty well worked out but they are different. ‘Love Hurt Bleed’ has been played live for a couple of years now, it’s almost like an old song. It is different on the record but in detail really rather than anything dramatic. The structure is as it was, although we’ve made it more powerful than what we were able to do live funnily enough.
We played ‘I Am Dust’ live and that might be a little bit different on the album with the main groove. I’ve been compiling all of the demos and I noticed some of them were quite different, others were just more polished. But as songs, they were very much the same.
The way I work is I write them here and I work them up to a reasonably finished level, but knowing Ade is going to change everything! I give him a quality direction as to what I’m aiming for. He then works on them, sends them back and we have an argument. We change things, we argue again and we end up with what we end up with.
You joked in the ‘Splinter’ trailer about having a song at 150BPM. Do you find you have a natural aversion to faster tempos now?
Yes, I do! I think it’s impossible to convey any kind of atmosphere at that sort of speed! It’s just going to be a mental dance track and that’s it! The thing on the trailer that I was joking about was my drummer has been having a go at me for ages that I couldn’t write a song at 150BPM. I said “I can, I just don’t want to”! So we had a £50 bet on it! So there is one that’s 150 but it’s actually at half tempo, it’s running at 75… you can write everything at double time and halve it when you record. So technically, he owes me £50! But he’s not having it because he goes “it’s not really is it? It says 150 on the machine but it isn’t!”*laughs*
Which one was that?
I can’t remember! It might be ‘Love Hurt Bleed’! *laughs*
‘Who Are You?’ will be popular with those who like your uptempo anthemic songs like ‘Listen To My Voice’, what’s that one about?
I wrote that for a film; when I moved to LA, I was asked by a company to write the end credit song. It came out really well and I thought it would be good to have it on the album because it would help their film and the album but I don’t think that will work now due to the scheduling. So lyrically, it’s to do with the subject matter of the film which about a musician who has a schizophrenic personality. He’s actually a murderer but is also very charming so it’s about that.
In a sense, it doesn’t sit quite as comfortably within ‘Splinter’ for that reason but it works well. It sounds like it belongs there and gave the album another big uptempo track which it needed. I think the balance of the album is right; without that song, there would have been too many slower, doom steady kind of things so it gave it the right balance.
Do you know the title of the film?
I don’t actually, it had a working title but they’re not calling it that and they haven’t told me what they’re releasing under yet but we might know soon.
Your friend John Foxx still plays with vintage analogue kit while you’re happy with using the latest gear. What’s your favourite piece of equipment at the moment whether virtual or hardware, and where do you see music technology heading?
I’m very software based. There’s a company called Native Instruments who do some great stuff.
There’s another called Spectrasonics who make the backbone of what I do, they’ve got a bit of software called Omnisphere which is phenomenal but everyone’s got it unfortunately. So you have to be careful that you don’t use sounds everybody else has heard, you got to try and manipulate them into something new or else you will just become a preset jockey as so many people are!
It’s difficult to avoid it really because some of the sounds are just so amazing! Much as I understand other people wanting to go back to old equipment, I absolutely do not share it. I have no interest in it really… it might be because I’ve been around a long time, but I feel I got all the good sounds out of that equipment when I had it the first time.
And if I go back to it, it’s going to sound reminiscent… if I could come up with different sounds, they’re still coming from the same place, they going to have that buzzy analogue sound to them. And much as I love it, I feel like I’ve used it and for me, it will sound as if I’ve gone backwards… people will be going “ooooh great, that sounds like ‘The Pleasure Principle’”! I don’t want people to say that!
My interest in electronic music has always been to try and find sounds that I’ve not heard before. That’s always been the thing that’s most exciting and fun about it. So going back to old equipment will sound like variations of things I have done before, it doesn’t hold any real interest but each to their own. If other people find that inspiring and of interest, then that’s great.
I look forward to what Spectrasonics are going to do next. I get really deep into the technology for new sounds. When I was making this album, I was finding all kinds of software. I got loads of stuff from a company called, and it’s a terrible name, Best Service! What a sh*t name for a company but brilliant software! A lot of the Arabian stuff that you mentioned came from them. Mark Of The Unicorn did a fantastic bit of software with Arabian stuff too.
So what did you do with the Minimoog you found in your garage?
That is still being rebuilt! I got an email a few months ago from the guy who’s repairing it with a photo and it looked perfect.
He said he was waiting for some more parts which are quite hard to find and… I’ve heard nothing from him since! *laughs*
I had another Minimoog before that which I had rebuilt but the one that I found in my garage when I was moving to emigrate to the US, that was in a terrible state! F***ing hell, I couldn’t believe it! You’re hacking away at a bush and there’s a synthesizer underneath it! *laughs*
Is that going to end up in a museum, or are you possibly going to use it?
I was going to sell it because I’ve got no love for them whatsoever. But I’m beginning to build some kind of affection for that little one because it’s had such a horrible life… it’s toured with me around the world and been on my albums, and then I’ve abandoned it in a loft and a bush grows on top of it. That’s harsh! And now it’s hopefully all lovely and working again… whether I ever use it again, I doubt very much but I think I will keep it. I might actually mount it on the wall and just have it there, I think it deserves to be kept. Or I might even donate it to the Hard Rock Café or someone like that who might want it for a display item. But I’ll probably sell the other one…
I was interested in asking why with the excellent ‘A Prayer For The Unborn’ remix Andy Gray did back in 2001, you hadn’t pursued that more blippy but dark electronic direction as it appeared to suit you?
Yeah, I do like it… and that’s the version we always do live. I’ve not played the original version of that since Andy did his version. He did an amazing version of ‘Dead Sun Rising’ as well. He’s just brilliant, he’s a f***ing genius. In the future, I would definitely want to make a full album with Andy Gray and it would be more that way. We’ve done a couple of songs together and I love them both.
Sometimes, it’s about your own ambitions and what you want to do. Me and Ade go in a certain direction which I love and that is what I want at the moment, I’ve been pretty clear about where I want to go. It could be that we will go in different directions, I don’t know. With Andy, I would go into it with a slightly more open mind and see where it takes us.
Photo by Keith Trigwell
Your US tour includes two dates opening for NINE INCH NAILS. Is the possibility of you and Trent Reznor writing and recording together getting closer to becoming a reality?
It’s something that we’ve mentioned in the past a few times. Before, being in England was always a bit of an issue because you can’t just drop in when you have a free hour.
Trent works constantly, I’ve never known anybody with a work ethic like it! It should be much easier now, I’m only 20 minutes away from him.
But now the whole NINE INCH NAILS thing is up and running again and he’s mega busy with that. I’ve seen two of the shows already and it’s amazing. He sent me the album a few weeks back and it’s really cool. He’s just really good at what he does isn’t he? It’s always going to be good.
So I hope to, that would be something I’d be really excited about doing at some point in the future, but somewhat intimidated… it’s the only outstanding one for me. We’re mates and we live near each other, so it would seem to be something that is likely to happen at some point in the future but we’ll see… it’s been 10 years since we first talked about it so it’s obviously not going to happen anytime soon! *laughs*
You were spotted at DEPECHE MODE’s first London date on the ‘Delta Machine’ tour. How does it feel to know you and DM have both made such a worldwide impact from your Synth Britannia beginnings?
Yeah… their career’s done rather well compared to mine I would say! They’re doing football stadiums in every country on the planet and I’m not! I’m not jealous! Not envious at all about what’s happened to them! *roars of laughter*
They’ve done amazing and go from phenomenon to phenomenon. Just unbelievable really how well they done. Alan Wilder is a really good mate of mine, I regret that he’s not in the band anymore. I love DEPECHE MODE but my favourite period is ‘Songs Of Faith & Devotion’ where they went darker, heavier and frightening almost!
I think Alan has to take the lion share of the credit for that because I know he shaped that whole sound on ‘Black Celebration’, ‘Violator’, ‘Songs Of Faith & Devotion’ etc. For me, it got more and more interesting, and was really inspiring.
‘Songs Of Faith & Devotion’ was a key album in my music becoming much heavier back in 1994 and having the long career that I have had. In the early 90s, my career was pretty much dead and buried. But then I made ‘Sacrifice’ which resurrected me and off I went again. ‘Songs Of Faith & Devotion’ has a real big hand to play in that album so I’ve got a huge gratitude to Alan Wilder. He probably more than anyone was instrumental in saving my career. I wrote the songs, but I don’t know I would have done if I hadn’t had heard ‘Songs Of Faith & Devotion’. It just made me think differently and it made me want to make a different kind of music. It was massively important and that’s just the truth of it.
Have you and Alan Wilder ever discussed working together?
We never have actually but that would be great! He’s another one who’s an absolute genius. I love all of his RECOIL stuff and moan at him a lot that he should work more and get a singer! *laughs*
The work that he does is fantastic and maybe that’s something I should pursue because I love him, we get on really well… yeah… you’ve got some good ideas!
The move to the States appears to have relaxed you, you’ve even been tweeting photos of your holiday and dog Wilbur…
It hasn’t changed my songwriting at all, I still write the same sort of things as I did before. But in terms of life, it’s an amazing place to be. It’s difficult to praise up somewhere else without offending the British, because they get very easily offended of you don’t love Britain. *laughs*
I do love Britain, but moving here was very difficult decision to make. I have to say having done it, and there and many things I do miss like friends and family, it’s amazing here.
And 20 minutes drive away is the ocean, Malibu or Hollywood. I’ve had breakfast in Hollywood and you can park outside a restaurant… it’s not like England where there’s one parking space for every 2000 cars and if you do find one, you have to pay £10 a minute! Here, there’s valet parking for $2 for the day! Brilliant!
The weather is beautiful, you can live a very outdoor life because it doesn’t rain. It’s pretty here because they’re got irrigation and there’s greenery. There’s so much to do and so much entertainment here. It’s a culture unashamedly geared to having a good time. In England, you’re kind of made guilty for having a boat. It’s so different here and they seem to enjoy life and living in way I’ve not experienced anywhere else.
There is far less cynicism, less aggression. The British view of America is guns and violence, and although that is here, it’s very much located in certain areas. Where I live is peaceful and calm. I’ve not seen a fight since I’ve been here and I’ve been here 9-10 months now. I guarantee I could get off the plane in England and see that within an hour anywhere, any time of the day!
You gonna see a little drunk f***er or some thug in the street shouting or spitting! It’s kind of part of our culture and for all the talk of guns and violence in the US, it is not part of your day-to-day life. I’ve not been out for one single moment with the children where I tried to shoo them away or take them to one side or move on, not at all! Yet, it happened regularly in England, even in my little local village. So from that point of view, it really is better.
ELECTRICITYCLUB.CO.UK gives its warmest thanks to GARY NUMAN
Atlanta Masquerade (25th October), Asheville Mountain Oasis Festival (26th October), Washington Black Cat (27th October), Brooklyn Music Hall of Williamsburg (29th October), Sunrise BB&T Center (October 30 – with NINE INCH NAILS), Orlando Amway Center (31st October – with NINE INCH NAILS), Bristol 02 Academy (7th November), Dublin Button Factory (8th November), Sheffield 02 Academy (11th November), Newcastle 02 Academy (12th November), Glasgow 02 ABC (13th November), Manchester Academy (14th November) Oxford 02 Academy (15th November), London Roundhouse (16th November), Brighton The Dome (18th November), Wolverhampton Wulfrun Hall (19th November)
Text and Interview by Chi Ming Lai
Album artwork photography by LaRoache Brothers at Woolhouse Studios
Other photos as credited or from Gary Numan’s Official Facebook page
17th October 2013
Long-term NINE INCH NAILS followers have probably been going through a process of continually pinching themselves this year following their unexpected return.
After putting the band into deep-freeze four years ago, Trent Reznor and side man Atticus Ross have focused on work for film director David Fincher.
This included ‘The Social Network’, whose haunting electronic/piano-based soundtrack bucked the trend of formulaic orchestral film music and picked up an unexpected, but well-deserved Oscar in the Music (Original Score) category in 2011.
The duo have also given an outlet to Reznor’s more commercial writing with the HOW TO DESTROY ANGELS project, fronted by his wife Mariqueen Maandig.
Spin back to 11th September 2009 in Los Angeles, and following an epic 3 hour plus set (including a certain GAary Numan guesting on 3 tracks), Reznor said “This is it” and retired the act from the live arena, but not ruling out future music from the project.
So here we are nearly 4 years to the day and the band have already made a string of high profile festival appearances, debuting a stunning new ‘Stop Making Sense’ inspired live show where the band members appear one at a time to the strains of new track ‘Copy Of A’ – which brings us to the album where that track makes its recorded appearance.
In the studio environment, NINE INCH NAILS has always been primarily a one man show for Trent Reznor, but this time round, the three big surprise collaborators here are legendary FLEETWOOD MAC member Lindsey Buckingham, occasional DAVID BOWIE collaborator Adrian Belew and bass player Pino Palladino, who along with Mick Karn, helped define THAT fretless bass sound, and along the way becoming the session man for everybody from TEARS FOR FEARS and Paul Young through to Gary Numan on the ‘I, Assassin’ album.
In terms of sonic textures and sounds, there are parallels with ‘Delta Machine’ here, but in contrast to DEPECHE MODE’s apparent aura of desperation to match past glories, NINE INCH NAILS make this sound a hell of lot more effortless in its approach and it’s the sound of an artist completely at ease with himself. If you are a fan of the sound of analogue sequencers and synths, you will LOVE this album – over the years, Reznor has amassed a huge arsenal of gear including a wall of Doepfer modular equipment and vintage ARP and EMS products, and they are all put to good use on ‘Hesitation Marks’.
After the clipped overture opening of ‘The Eater of Dreams’ we are straight into the electronic pulses of ‘Copy Of A’, a filtered and enveloped sequencer line is joined by a simple but insistent 4-4 kick/snare which builds in a layered fashion before treated guitars and looped vocals propel the track to a climatic middle section, before ramping down the dynamics towards the end of the track.
Up next, and for most, the first exposure to the sound of the album is ‘Came Back Haunted’ a strong track, but with a slight air of “heard it before” stemming from the fact that it shares it’s main chord progression with previous ‘With Teeth’ single ‘The Hand That Feeds’. That aside, this is another compelling electronic track with fractured TR909 beats, that also introduces the trademark Reznor guitar sound that defined much of ‘The Slip’. Strip following track ‘Find My Way’ of its vocals and it could quite easily find a home on ‘The Social Network’ soundtrack; Reznor does this atmospheric/textural sound so well and the semi Hip-Hop style beats and low piano notes recall MASSIVE ATTACK’s wonderful ‘Protection’.
‘All Time Low’ starts with a squall of delayed Robert Smith-esque guitar and then a ‘Closer’ style beat and vocal are introduced. Lyrically with its “Hey! Everything is not OK”, it says nothing really new and provides the album with its first “meh” moment, the only saving grace being when (at the four and a half minute mark) a graceful hypnotic/echoed arpeggiator line enters and takes the track to its conclusion.
Just when you feel like the album’s quality control and diversity is going to take a dive, along comes ‘Everything’ – the track’s opening ‘New Life’ analogue drum pattern is a curveball as once up and running, this is the most direct and conventional track here by a long shot, the descending fuzzed guitar and bass recalling THE CURE (again) and JOY DIVISION (NIN having previously covered the band with their interpretation of ‘Dead Souls’ on ‘The Crow’ soundtrack).
‘I Would For You’ is also one of the standout’s here, primarily as Reznor pushes his (and am sure he would be the first to admit this) limited vocal range a little further and instills a welcome element of passion to the choruses, taking his voice into a higher range before another atmospheric coda finishes the song.
This is an album that will take a few listens to truly sink in, as many of its hooks are not that direct on a cursory appraisal, but what it does do so well is beautifully atmospheric synthetic textures and for many will signal a welcome return to the more electronic sound of NIN’s debut album ‘Pretty Hate Machine’. Trent Reznor is now clearly in a much more comfortable place, the self-loathing alcoholic and drug addict of old has been replaced by a married family man and ‘Hesitation Marks’ sends out a clear signal that he is no longer part of the downward spiral.
‘Hesitation Marks’ is released on 3rd September 2013 by Columbia Records on CD, deluxe 2CD, vinyl and download
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JOHN FRYER is the renowned producer, engineer and musician who was also a member of THIS MORTAL COIL. 
How did you first become acquainted with recording synthesizers?
By ‘A Broken Frame’, the equipment became more sophisticated with things like the PPG Wave 2, Simmons drums and Roland TR808. What were those like to work with?
is released on 14th October by Mortal Records / Cooking Vinyl as a CD, deluxe CD and double vinyl
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